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Thread: This is just evil

  1. #1
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    Was reading this:
    http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/users/rja14/tcpa-faq.html

    I'm going to have nightmares for a week.
    I thought Microsoft wanted to own all and be all.
    Now I am absolutely certain.

    The scary thing is... with all the fear of terrorism
    and the non-stop lobbying by the RIAA of congress
    I believe what the paper describes to be completely inevitable.

    Abandon all hope.
    Soon, you will have to have an M$ passport just to walk to the corner store and buy a beer.

    "Is this beer Microsoft certified?"

  2. #2
    Retired Mod aversion's Avatar
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    sounds crappy, i'm going to buy a mac. It's funny though, all we have to do to stop this is not buy it, if everyone bought macs or linux machines they would be screwed, yet we all keep giving MS and intel (or amd) our money... i suppose it's like complaining about pollution and driving a car, unless everyone stops few people will.

    sounds horribly distopian though.





    on a side note it constantly annoys me when talking about digital music rights people say things like, "...expect Sir Michael Jagger to get very slightly richer" (as this article does)like rich old musicians are the only ones having their songs passed around for free. It's just so skewed to drop comments like that in without context.





  3. #3
    Slackware 9.0 Runes_Tooth's Avatar
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    We need to start commercials to stop people from buying Microsoft and Intel products! It will be like the Truth commercials to stop smoking.

  4. #4
    New Wave Visionray's Avatar
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    Quote from the article...

    "There is a downside too. There will be remote censorship: the mechanisms designed to delete pirated music under remote control may be used to delete documents that a court (or a software company) has decided are offensive - this could be anything from pornography to writings that criticise political leaders."


    All I can say is...

    WHAT???!!!
    WTF?




  5. #5
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    Thumbs up

    Originally posted by aversion
    sounds crappy, i'm going to buy a mac.
    Hey, me too waiting for the G5's to come out.
    But, I don't see that as protection.
    The RIAA will see to it that newer CD's and DVD's only operate on 'trusted' operating systems and software.
    So going with a Mac or untrusted paltform could mean not having access to such media.

    Another one of my concerns here isn't the desktop, but the server area. What happens to non-.net products?
    There are competing, open source development projects out there such as Mono by Ximian and One by Sun, but I become concerned that the 'trusted' party clout may really damper usage of open source alternitives for web service architectures, especially if you can't even install them because your server provider will only allow 'trusted' software on it's platforms or because you baught a wintell solution that wont allow it to be installed, even if you own the equiptment.

    Today, I'm actually thinking about going out and buying ASP just so I can start porting my open source PHP classes to VB objects and be invoked by ASP, just in case.

    Makes me shudder though, ASP is such a crap language.


    I do hear you about the little one liners about rich getting richer and all that, but there will always be some FUD in any article written by someone who takes a side.

    It is important to keep in mind that organizations such as the Electronic Frontier Foundation (site: http://www.eff.org/ I suggest you visit) do file class action cases on behalf of the computer user, but I'm not sure if even they can do much about this, this will take an act of Congress, and with the current climate in Washington and the fact that Palladium jives very nicely with the DMCA, I doubt Congress will want to get in the way of the RIAA, M$ and Intell.
    Especially considering how closely this parallels another act of Congress and the RIAA lobbyists - the Consumer Broadband and Digital Television Promotion Act (CBDTPA)
    which is very similar to Palladian, but for broadband, cable and your TV.

  6. #6
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    You have the right to remain silent
    You have the right to watch what we tell you to watch when and where and how we tell you.
    You have the right to have all your files deleted and pictures of you sitting around nude taken by us on your webcam for sh*ts and giggles.

    - The wintell/RIAA Global constitition circa 2006

  7. #7
    Retired Mod aversion's Avatar
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    hopefully governments will be forced into action by public opinions, if everything in this article is true then there is competitive practice to think about ever mind personal freedoms.

    this is one of the good things about the computer industry being so new, congress isn't in bed with them the same way it is with the oil cartels and mineral giants, so they might do something.

    plus a bunch of class action law suits might help... have to keep an eye on this one.





  8. #8
    I Mastered Dead Technology TallGuyLittleCar's Avatar
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    aversion is right, if, big if, what the arcticle states as fact I'm sure the ACLU will have a jolly good time.



  9. #9
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    Originally posted by TallGuyLittleCar
    aversion is right, if, big if, what the arcticle states as fact I'm sure the ACLU will have a jolly good time.
    Go to the serpents liar yourself:
    http://www.trustedcomputing.org/tcpaasp4/index.asp
    ...the homepage of sata.. I mean the good people who want to bring you 'trusted' computing. Maybe that will convince you this is real. I don't post scary Orwellian stuff just for fun... only when I feel like holding a vid-cam to my flashlight illuminated face and scream.


  10. #10
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    And I should note that any ACLU action would be speculative.
    Highly speculative. Look at the entire M$ anti-trust charade. Maybe I'm jaded on the USDOJ's handling of the affair, but really...
    think about it.

    It's Intell, HPQ, M$, and 180 other companies list on the link above. Almost 200.

    Now, you think the USDOJ is going to go side with the ACLU?
    For what? Preventing people from listing to music they bought on an 'untrusted' machine or with 'untrusted' software? The problem here is copyright law and the DMCA.

    Perhaps you never heard of the DMCA, it's what put that Russian programmer in Jail for doing what was legal in his country, and legal in ours till just a couple years ago.
    Electronic Copy protection is protected by Congress, and no ACLU suit will put a stop to that.

    And that's the killer here.
    You take them to court because so and so app wont install on your platform, they'll just look around and say "Who's faults that? You should have made sure the equiptment you bought worked as intended, you are the consumer. Oh... that CD wont play? Too bad. the choice was yours."

    Really, you have no rights in this case, the rights all belong to the corporate copyright holder, you are just a peon. If you don't like it, don't buy it.
    And I hardly doubt that people en mass will just stop buying Windows and every other item Palladian gets shipped in:

    "Others will note that the Windows-only Palladium will, at least in the short run, further bolster the Windows monopoly. In time, says Microsoft, Palladium will spread out. “We don’t blink at the thought of putting Palladium on your Palm... on the telephone, on your wris****ch,” says software architect Brian Willman"
    Your wrist watch, your blender and your daughters easybake oven, anything and everything with a microchip inside.

    To be certain, it does have value and good uses, but it has some very bad potential if used improperly as well.

  11. #11
    Slackware 9.0 Runes_Tooth's Avatar
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    So why is this called `Trusted Computing'? I don't see why I should trust it at all!

    It's almost an in-joke.

    25. So a `Trusted Computer' is one that can break my security?


    Now you've got it.
    Oh, how comforting.

  12. #12
    I Mastered Dead Technology TallGuyLittleCar's Avatar
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    no offense lougeboy but you need to read up on the american legal system

    The ACLU and doj often but heads. its the court system that decies. And court's often decide agianst the government.

    But you are right, its not even a rights case in anyway.

    Don't want to deal with it, don't buy it.

    Corporations will follow the dollar.

  13. #13
    supervillain gerbick's Avatar
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    about to trade in my MCSE for a RHCE...

    this Palladium/HailStorn is crazy stuffs. johnie in one thread, had a point. New laws need to be advanced to fight this invasion of privacy, what not. I don't know about you, but I'll be supporting other OS's here, very soon.

  14. #14
    Slackware 9.0 Runes_Tooth's Avatar
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    soon? support them now before this stuff gets big!

  15. #15
    supervillain gerbick's Avatar
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    it takes a lot of money to replace my seven server network. and even money to buy the software I need to replace everything I have for windows.

    but it's happening. know that.

  16. #16
    I Mastered Dead Technology TallGuyLittleCar's Avatar
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    reading more.

    I love they way the are naming things after sentator Hollings. Your rep. Gerbick?




  17. #17
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    Originally posted by gerbick
    it takes a lot of money to replace my seven server network. and even money to buy the software I need to replace everything I have for windows.

    but it's happening. know that.
    Ya, but with the other act I mentioned the CBDTPA, you'll probably also have to replace your Satelite Dish, DVD player and any other broadcast reception/media playback equiptment that will not operate without 'signal tags' which will prevent you from copying broadcasts they don't want you to even those sent over airwave.

    Or so they say, I read that in the paper a couple weeks back, it's not law yet, and the industry hasn't made any definitive announcement to proceed, but it's definitely a hot item on the table.

    But, something major is happening here, and it's all backed by the RIAA and the major television networks and film studios. They claim that they wont proceed with broadband adaptation such as HDTV without assurance that their broadcasts wont get ripped and pilfered over Gnutella net.

    And ya, it does take a lot of money to replace all that equiptment... over 3 million DVD players have been sold already, all those units stand to become obsolete, and needing to be replaced by equiptment that will work with their proposed system.

    I think the manufacturers are pleased with that prospect.
    "Oh... it doesn't work anymore, well, buy a new one"
    "What give you a new one for free? We're sorry, but a change in media format is not covered by any warranty"

    [Edited by l0ungeb0y on 07-12-2002 at 05:39 PM]

  18. #18
    supervillain gerbick's Avatar
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    I have been fighting Hollings since I moved into this state mang. not my rep, not one bit.

    idiot needs to read what he's trying to pass, and stop accepting money from Hollywood, RIAA, and other special interest groups...

  19. #19
    Nyuk! Nyuk! Nyuk! Hey Moe... serpent star's Avatar
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    http://www.senate.gov/~hollings/features_broadband.html

    Thought this might be of interest. This guy is a maniac. Who obviously has his finger on the pulse of the corporations soft money stream rather than the US Constitution or the people who live under it. The spin is amazing.

  20. #20
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    Sounds like you guys in the States are having similar issues as we are in Australia, with politicians being overly influenced by campaigning mega-corps, mainly due to the technology involved being so new that most of the average "Joe Public" has no idea of anything they should complain about, hence there's no real pressure from anyone other than the corporations.

    The difference being of course that so much of what is decided in the States with regards to the major corporations and their ability to impose restrictions or processes onto the user is then replicated throughout most of the western world.

    And another point mentioned, it's all well and good to talk about not using their products, but it can be very expensive to switch, and you also have issues with your clients and audience using certain products that you must then use...etc.

    I'm hoping certain regulations to protect the consumer will be implemented rather than have to change our entire work practices. We'll see....

    I think we must all keep awake to these goings ons..


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