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Thread: What's yours is mine..

  1. #1
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    What's yours is mine..

    I've had a client asking me whether or not a website i'll be creating for them - including images and so on, will belong to them after they've paid me for it.

    My obvious response to this was yes - you payed for it, so it's yours. Apparently they've had problems in the past with these type of issues.

    So my question is, is this the correct way of doing things? After creating the website or image, you place everything on a CD and basically give them an off-line version of the website? Or are you allowed to say no?

    Just got me thinking and would like to know your experiences/opinions.

    Thanx!
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  2. #2
    is not a good designer. No-Tec's Avatar
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    Well think logically. Do they have any need for the FLA's/PSD's? You can go the 'somewhat' non-moral way, grab them by the balls, and keep the files or make them pay extra for them. This will ensure they will need you for later changes in the site and cannot go somewhere else for cheaper or whatever the reason be. They cant "force" you to give them the files unless its in the contract.
    What I have done in the past is put them on there serve zipped/rared up and tell them to get them there. Unless theres like 500 megs of files, than yeah, A cd would be your best bet. But dont give them the only copy of the files, keep a copy for yorself of course.



    They pai you for the design, not for the files. Its like the people who buy photoshop, they dont get the soucecode with it. Ya know? Althouh that would be cool.
    maybe.

  3. #3
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    Ya, i will only give them html or jpg of swf versions. Although, when designing a logo for a company, are u not supposed to give them the vector image in say a CorelDraw format, or only the exported verson of the image?
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  4. #4
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    agree wit No-tec but if they want your source files charge them at least 60% more.

    i also make my clients sign an agreement in wich i state that all
    material is copyrighted and cannot be used by third parties without my agreement.
    Last edited by sense; 06-15-2003 at 07:30 AM.

  5. #5
    well really this should have been discussed. I believe you should have written down things like this in several documents, namely in the Tender under the design spec and also in the handover document/packaging and production document.

    Having said that, I'm not sure what way you actually went about things... ie was this actually legit, like binding contract etc etc or just worth-of-mouth and some things written down kinda thing. Anywhichway you did it, I'm guessing you didn't talk about things like this.
    If you are the one that is going to be maintaing their website every month etc etc, then you keep most of the original files and give them whatever you feel is appropriate/necessary. If its the scenario where you'll never see them again, then give them all the files or maybe just the ones that you think they need. But its all up to you; your prerogative.

  6. #6
    Retired Mod aversion's Avatar
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    in my experience the standard is NOT to supply source files to a client. If they do specify in the contract or MOU that they require source files thenm your price should reflect that.

    I know one well-known design house that adds 75% across the board to the price of a project if the source files are required by the client.

  7. #7
    is not a good designer. No-Tec's Avatar
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    Originally posted by AntD
    Ya, i will only give them html or jpg of swf versions. Although, when designing a logo for a company, are u not supposed to give them the vector image in say a CorelDraw format, or only the exported verson of the image?


    Well of course. unless you can deliver the logo to the printer yourself
    maybe.

  8. #8
    Retired Mod aversion's Avatar
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    Originally posted by AntD
    Although, when designing a logo for a company, are u not supposed to give them the vector image in say a CorelDraw format, or only the exported verson of the image?
    with a logo a vector format for the client should be a prerequisite, it doesn't have to be editable though, just resizeable.

    one thing to remember when creating a logo for a client is to specify what use they are entitled to put the logo. For larger clients it is generally any use but for smaller clients you can state that the logo may only be used on the web and paper products for example. I know one very large consulting company in toronto that didn't specify what use the logo they commisioned could be put to, and in his contract the creator said it could only be used on paper products. A few years down the line and they're still paying him for web use, merchandising use (mugs etc), etc.

    charge accordingly

  9. #9
    is not a good designer. No-Tec's Avatar
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    Originally posted by aversion
    with a logo a vector format for the client should be a prerequisite, it doesn't have to be editable though, just resizeable.

    one thing to remember when creating a logo for a client is to specify what use they are entitled to put the logo. For larger clients it is generally any use but for smaller clients you can state that the logo may only be used on the web and paper products for example. I know one very large consulting company in toronto that didn't specify what use the logo they commisioned could be put to, and in his contract the creator said it could only be used on paper products. A few years down the line and they're still paying him for web use, merchandising use (mugs etc), etc.

    charge accordingly

    I try to do things like that and the client says one thing like "no" or "umm" and I turn into a little girl and comply to there every whim. And ususally end up getting taken advantage of. Especially when it's across the nation work or something. And I'm still a youngin so they tell me that they are right or whatever. Tis sad.
    maybe.

  10. #10
    Retired Mod aversion's Avatar
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    I think you just have to act like a professional, make sure there is a contract, get them to sign a memorandum of understanding that states formats, usage, copyright clearance responsibility, all that kind of thing.

    But in reality the only people that can really get away with making logo clients pay per usages are the big, established, well-known designers, most clients paying a freelancer for work will expect digital, paper and merchandisign use to be included. I've certainly never quibbled about it with a client, but I do make sure to state in the MOU exactly what they are getting, so they can at least appreciate that!

    With source files, FLAs and PSDs, I certainly wouldn't supply them without extra payment, and no one has asked for them so far. We stipulate to the client in the MOU that source files aren't included, so if they do ever ask down the line we have something we can point to. The good business idea is that clients stick with you to make future changes but there will always be those that want to try it out themselves. I know that we've taken over sites from other designers who haven't supplied us with original source files, which is understandable

  11. #11
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    Thanx for the advice people - someone should actually bring out a book on the etiquette of setting up a design contract with a firm. You know - all the ins and outs, what to do, what not to do, etc. If you're a freelancer working for yourself, i think you stand a big risk of being taken advantage of. It's not a dog eat dog world for nothing!
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