SWiSH, what do you think of it?

[roger_onslow]

Originally posted by ViRGo_RK
[B]Why buy something else that does the same thing? Answer me that./B]

Who asked you to buy it .. not me.

SWiSH is not a Flash add-on. y'know.

If you've got SWiSH, you don't really need Flash and if you've got Flash you don't really need SWiSH. If you're lucky enough to have both, then you can choose the tool that most easily does what you want to do.

If you're happy with Flash, that's wonderful. I wish you all the joy and happiness in the world

[Olly K]

I have both

and use both

[the_real_tisse]

To all you die hard MM Flash adepts, you are welcome to your opinion (by the way, noone is saying you have to use Swish, but if you comment on Swish, would be nice if you knew the program itself).

I would suggest you check out the next version and eat your words. And yes, you will have to I'm afraid.

Maths, variables, collision detection, .... you name it. It is all in there.

And in case this is too harsh, reread your comments, this is 'kid stuff' compared to your vocabulary

kind regards
Tisse

[Firefuze]

I don't think I'll be getting Swish Max anytime soon. I used Swish 2 for about a year, I made plenty of sites, banners, intro's etc. with it. But i find that when it comes to getting client work, it's a bit harder when you say I use "Swish"... the response is usually something like... Oh... Swish, nevermind we want a real flash designer. It's usually something along those lines.. and even when I do get the job, It usually would pay less than if I did something with Flash.

So in conclusion I think Swish is great and all, but why use Swish if you can use Flash, and get payed more? Also I feel it's more rewarding for me when I make something in flash because I feel as if I made it, not something the program made for me.

Just my 2 cents.

[C.Schwalbach]

You can make more money using flash? That's about insane. If you have a GREAT site, and are a good designer, and I like your work, am I going to be like oh, you use a different program to make work(which is better) than other flash users, so I don't want to go with you? That seems like the stupidest client in the world if you ask me. Also, you are using Flash, Flash animation, just not MX, why not just tell them that yes, you do use flash.??

So in conclusion, I think mx is great and all, but why use flash when you can buy swish for much less, and get payed just as much? Also, swishmax doesn't create things for you anymore like flash does, and in a thread I read about flash mx2, on the first couple posts I read I think 3 of them were asking for text effects like swish, yes the real designers were asking for that....

Just My 2 cents

[Firefuze]

I tell them i use Swish, if I dont and at the end when they ask for the source file and I give them the .swi, they'll be like... I want the .FLA

And when I do tell them I use Swish, they reaction is usually oh... Swish, I can use that. Especially when they ask for the swish website and see stuff like CREATE FLASH FX IN 2MIN!!! Stuff like that... makes it unprofessional.

[roger_onslow]

What tool you use has nothing to do with whether or not you or your results are professional or not .. That is ALL to do with the quality of your work and your attitude toward and treatment of your clients.

A true professional will use the most appropriate tool to get the job done for the least expense in time and resources.

If your clients don't understand that, well, that's a shame, they'll end up paying through the nose. Perhaps as customers become aware of this, they'll start ASKING for SWiSH instead of Flash because they know they'll get better value for money .. and because if they get the source code, they'll have something that they are able to more easily maintain themselves.

BTW: Many Flash professionals never give clients the source code anyway, so what they use to develop it make no difference.

Of course, its up to each of you what tool or tools you decide to use .. but it looks like scraping the bottom of the barrel with arguments like this against using SWiSH.

[Firefuze]

I'm just saying that whenever I tell someone i used Swish, or I'll be using Swish, the reaction is like.. ohh Swish you use that... As if it weren't what the professional use. I'm not trying to bash Swish, it's great, i've used it for quite some time. But a lot of people think it's just another cheesy program that is only good for making text effects.

[DMS8]

If they say that, show them some sites you have made in swish, and some sites you made in flash. Don't tell them which is which, and ask them if they can tell the difference.

[c4gnet]

Originally posted by phreakdevil
Be a man use Flash.

uh ... women cant use flash? i prefer flash altho id never tried swish.

i used to look at swish as a shortcut to text fx ... i didnt like it bec the fx seemed to be everywhere: i wanted to make my own ..

but now it seems swish has come a long way from that and could be worth a try ... and if it saves time, ditch the pretense about taking a shortcut ... at least you get more time to be productive ...

am i making sense?

[the sherrif]

i had swish...










i deleted swish after 6 months...








the end.







it kept me entertained, but i would never use it for professional/client work.

i dont intend to "eat my words," - i will always go for the better product in my eyes.

[C.Schwalbach]

Exactly what kind of swish did you have? 2.0? Compared to this one, 2.0 is worth deleting after 6 months, and I am guessing I would've if I would've known flash at the time. And I know you won't eat your words, because you are probably too much of a coward to try it, because you know you will be proved wrong.

[Markp.com]

Originally posted by Firefuze
I'm just saying that whenever I tell someone i used Swish, or I'll be using Swish, the reaction is like.. ohh Swish you use that... As if it weren't what the professional use. I'm not trying to bash Swish, it's great, i've used it for quite some time. But a lot of people think it's just another cheesy program that is only good for making text effects.

Yup totally agree with you Swish is looked down upon and I think it always will be.

You swish boys can argue as much as you like about how great you think it is, but when was the last time you saw a high profile swish job vacant? Never, because flash is the main tool, the big "I AM". Flash is seen as beeing a Pro tool (and rightly so in my oppinion) and swish is seen as something an amature will use.

I think you are just going round and round with this conversation... but each to their own

[Spirit of 44]

My biggest problem with Swish is that it is hopeless with audio. Then there's lots of little problems....

Now with this SwishMax are they trying to directly complete with Flash or still claim to be an easier and faster way to make swf files ? Or even both !?

I bought Swish (already had MX) because I saw there were some particular elements I could create faster using Swish. But when I then tried to branch out I discovered just how unfriendly and clunky the app was.

There are some simple things like controlled pans and zooms which Swish just doesn't cope with. Streaming audio ? You should see their suggested work-around. A joke considering some of the fast and clever alternatives. Hell, it's often hard to even see where and how big your stage is !

Too often with Swish I'd get to a certain point and then the app just seemed to run out of puff - it didn't have the capabilities to do the job.

I also found some of the Swish people to be VERY defensive - they seemed incapable of handling criticism and kept defending it's weak areas (such as audio) as if they were quite OK.

Now maybe with this Max version they've fixed those areas up - I'd certainly hope so.

I haven't used Swish for maybe eight months - even a year. Max ? Hmmmm, it'd have to have some pretty major enhancements to even bother testing the demo.

[ViRGo_RK]

I do not have any doubt that it does what Flash does. But to have to programs to do the same thing, thats a tad redundant, don't you think?

[the sherrif]

well of course it can do what flash does, because its not the IDE that does anything, its the player. at the end of the day its just bytecode, and swish will be limited to its capabilities through the player - and its pretty obvious to say that MM knows exactly what the player is capable of and then use this knowledge to build the IDE. And so, like markP said (i think), the swift team will always be behind a step. they are just making competition for the Flash IDE (which hey, might mean our requests for new IDE's get more attention).

but its cool that there is an alternative (if you can call it that) for Flash.

as soon as documentation is made fully available for the new player, its going to take months for the swish team to get back on track.

[Firefuze]

You swish boys can argue as much as you like about how great you think it is, but when was the last time you saw a high profile swish job vacant? Never, because flash is the main tool, the big "I AM". Flash is seen as beeing a Pro tool (and rightly so in my oppinion) and swish is seen as something an amature will use.

That's what I've been trying to say... No matter how professional Swish Max is, and how close to Flash it is, there are still a lot of people that view Macromedia Flash to be the professional tool, and Swish as the easy way out.

[david petley]

Originally posted by the sherrif


as soon as documentation is made fully available for the new player, its going to take months for the swish team to get back on track.

now that is an interesting comment...who is to say they don't have it already.

Who knows what goes on in the world of software production?...Except of course the people who are the software producers.


david p.

[the sherrif]

i think it would be in Macromedia's interest not to release documentation to other companies before thry release thier own IDE - unless they pay for it, in which case anything is possible. Furthermore, it probably changes several times during beta testing.

[david petley]

Originally posted by the sherrif
i think it would be in Macromedia's interest not to release documentation to other companies before thry release thier own IDE - unless they pay for it, in which case anything is possible. Furthermore, it probably changes several times during beta testing.

Yes...I agree totally....but I do not know, which was my point.

dp