stolen work

**nurden** · 10-06-2003, 03:49 AM

needs some advice last year i started building a site for a client. Altho nothing was done with a contract(kicks self in ass) it was a favour friend type thing.

I was pai a large deposit and started work on the site. any way the guy keeps adding extra things he would like the site to do but still expecitng it within the deadline. Evetually the site ws more hassle than it was worth.

I decided i couldnt work anymore and wanted to withdraw all my work. Well on my test server all the graphics and flash were ripped and know he is using all my work and adapting it.

I spent alot of time on the design and do not want it used. BUt he will not take it down saying it his all his.

I have the orignal psds. Art work and 3d rendering. Were do i stand from a legal point of view. can i request all my grapics and flash are removed from his site ......????????????

**nurden** · 10-06-2003, 03:51 AM

i emailed asking for either a link or the graphics to be removed. but the email i received back was far from friendly or civil!

**J-Luv** · 10-06-2003, 11:36 AM

no contract, no glory. it may not be worth the time and hassle if nothing was in writing, especially if he paid you "something" for what work you did do.

if u plan to sue him keep in mind you are the one that will have to come out of pocket to bring him to justice, unless we're talking thousands of dollars (not two or three grand) then i would chalk it up as a loss.

**J-Luv** · 10-06-2003, 11:37 AM

Originally posted by nurden
i emailed asking for either a link or the graphics to be removed. but the email i received back was far from friendly or civil!

you should at least be able to get a link i would think though, damn, lol.

**Napalm** · 10-06-2003, 11:42 AM

The fact that you've withdrew from the project shows bad faith on your side. The fact that you the deadline didnt move (unless you agreed to it) show bad faith on the clients' side.

In my opinion this is a 50/50 case - you might win it or you might lose it. You've received compensation for the work you've done. I would cut my losses.

**nurden** · 10-06-2003, 12:02 PM

nah the deposit didnt cover it. I dont know how they did it but they rupped some of my custom applications written in php too. Not the database but the files. so can i really not do much!

**J-Luv** · 10-06-2003, 12:45 PM

are your php files copywrited? if so, then i would persue that issue and lead into the rest if going to court. if not copyrighted then get your chalk, lol.

**juxtaflo** · 10-06-2003, 01:36 PM

I think you handled this project very badly right from the start. I would chalk it up as a lesson in client relations and quit wasting your time trying to get your graphics back. That time would be much better spent trying to gain new business. Next time you can get a contract, limit scope creep and not put yourself in a position to get ripped off.

I would also suggest never jumping ship on a project. Find a way to resolve it. Running away should never be an option.

**nurden** · 10-06-2003, 02:59 PM

(i didnt explain fully)

This client was big trouble. and wouldnt agree to a contract half way through. By this time i had spent 3 months developing a site.. gutting i had to bail as i was gettin in deeper and thought **** i might not get paid for what ive done so far..

Big lesson learned and never agian.. just wondered where i stood.. guttting not being able to put some of your best work onthe portfolio becaue its been hammed togther with dodgy clipart and stuff

**hurricaneone** · 10-06-2003, 04:01 PM

In one post you're saying that this was a 'client', and in another, you're saying favour for a 'friend'.

Before you decide to jump into this kind of thing again, I recommend you define for yourself which it is you want the person you work for to be. And I would strongly advise you choose 'client', even if they are a friend. Keeping it all on the professional level of client/developer is the best way of preventing being taken advantage of, which is what seems to have happened to you here.

**J-Luv** · 10-06-2003, 04:07 PM

i went thru this same situation with my COUSIN..we have not spoken since, and he still owes me a GRAND.....trust me, try to avoid doing business with family and friends must understand its business and not personal and get everything in writing!!!!!!!!

**hurricaneone** · 10-06-2003, 04:25 PM

J-Luv, you know that you should be the big guy here and write off that cash - you know you're never gonna see it, and then just say that your cousin can take you out for some drinks and you'll call it evens.

Better to sort that one out before 20 years go by and you're still not talking. Unless, of course, your cousin's a complete arse, in which case, you're better off 'as is'.

**nurden** · 10-06-2003, 05:30 PM

the lead was from a friend and the cleint = was someone i knew but not that well... anyway i guess ill let this one slide (weep) sort of knew i would have to!

maybe i could sell my cheaply site to a template site and really screw him up....

**juxtaflo** · 10-06-2003, 06:02 PM

Originally posted by nurden
the lead was from a friend and the cleint = was someone i knew but not that well... anyway i guess ill let this one slide (weep) sort of knew i would have to!

maybe i could sell my cheaply site to a template site and really screw him up....

Yeah. Or use it as a template site yourself.

**Owen Sutton** · 10-08-2003, 10:09 AM

Definately a lesson learned here.

Cut your losses get something in writing next time. I don't use a contract as such, but before I start any job I send a document to the client clearly stating the part that each of the parties will play in the project - I will do this, this and this, and you will do (pay) this.

It's saved me so many times when the client start to add stuff to the job and doesn't know why I'll be charging him more - "but I thought we agreed...", "No, this is what we agreed..." (refering to document).

Just makes life easier and less stressful for everyone.

Better luck next time, we've all been there.

**J-Luv** · 10-08-2003, 11:28 AM

Originally posted by hurricaneone
J-Luv, you know that you should be the big guy here and write off that cash - you know you're never gonna see it, and then just say that your cousin can take you out for some drinks and you'll call it evens.

Better to sort that one out before 20 years go by and you're still not talking. Unless, of course, your cousin's a complete arse, in which case, you're better off 'as is'.

no, you're right but here's the quick version of the story....well, we did a flash navigation and html site for him with an animated intro...quoted him 2 grand....he agreed, so we did everything...he loses his job, cant pay for all the work so he jus wants the website and no flash intro (which took a coupla weeks to draw and animate) plus a completely different navigation and topics and a login section....so i gave him the website and the flash navigation but i gave him all SWF files and no FLA files and told him he could just make the changes himself....guess by now he realized you cant make changes to swf files aye?

.....but never again with friends or family when it comes to money, NO WAY!

**webcorps** · 10-08-2003, 12:37 PM

No offense J-Luv, i sympathize with your plight, but you should never charge family for ANYTHING. This might be subjective or cultural on my side, but charging family is just not kosher, not only for the reason you and the others have mentioned but also because it IS family, and you only get one til the end of your days, so serve them well.

**Datnigz2002** · 10-08-2003, 01:44 PM

You should have gotten a contract from the start. If he did not want to sign one you shouldn't have done business with him.. PERIOD..
Now its your word against his.. However, verbal agreements stand up in court.. But they are only powerful if you have a witness..

**J-Luv** · 10-08-2003, 04:52 PM

Originally posted by webcorps
No offense J-Luv, i sympathize with your plight, but you should never charge family for ANYTHING. This might be subjective or cultural on my side, but charging family is just not kosher, not only for the reason you and the others have mentioned but also because it IS family, and you only get one til the end of your days, so serve them well.

i agree, but its not as if he wanted a simple five page website with a flash graphic. he had a lot of needs and at the time money wasnt an issue for him and i have three other guys i work with - they were the ones that did the design and work on that project.

**Datnigz2002** · 10-08-2003, 04:55 PM

I read his story and didn't hear of anything of this involving family.. Did you read the story..

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