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Thread: Flash 8 Disappoints...

  1. #41
    Flash, Mans greatest invention
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    A lot of e-commerce do use flash just because they don’t make there sites all flash, Its never a good idea to make a site in all flash unless its for specifically related to a flash purpose. Your options are get good results on search engines and get flashes benefits by using flash/html in your site or you can use all flash and get bad listings on search engines a lot less customers but get the features of flash. The idea of flash is never meant to be all flash sites. When they announced the release of 8.5 and flex the MM CEO said its about integrating flash and html not flash taking over html and I think that’s spot on.

  2. #42
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    Hi All,

    For those justifying HTML, why is it that major dev's complain about HTML it's self (eg static, not really designed for handling data, etc.. not forgetting that alot put blame at the doors of HTTP itself).

    HTML is not moving forward, instead it is stagnant. We try and find new ways of trying to add additional functionality to a old of date method. True Flash has to sit on a HTML page, but for me the future would be that at that point we leave HTML there and continue using other methods for web sites.

    I guess the problems are that the more we discuss this, the more we understand that it isn't just Flash @ fault but the very bais of the web and the surrounding technologies.

    Cheers

    Carl
    [::TILL THE END::]

  3. #43
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    Microsoft's Sparkle addresses two of the points I made. I think it will be interesting to see how Macromedia responds.

    I would rarely recommend doing an entire site in Flash but the coolest online forum that I have ever seen was done in Flash using Flex and the coolest message board I have ever seen was done in Flash as well...they just aren't search engine friendly.
    Do you have some links?

  4. #44
    Give me the name Tink!!!!!!!
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    Flash 8 was based on putting more creativity and expresiveness into the tool> this was clearly announced as the intention and i think thye did a real good job of it.

    Flash is constantly growing and there are more and more 100% Flash sites. yes theres still things to be improved but the guys at MM aint robots!

    What are you comments on AS 3.0?
    Tink

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    The current user that has this name aint been online for absolutely ages.

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  5. #45
    Flash, Mans greatest invention
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    More full flash sites does not mean its a good idea just that theres more stupid people using flash.

    Flash has the problem of search engines and i think it always will so its just tough use html flash intergration or get bad search rankings.

    I dont think the problem is indexing flash the problem is it would be so easy to abuse.

  6. #46
    Give me the name Tink!!!!!!!
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    I'm not sure i said it was a good idea (well it is for me as thats what i do and more and more companies are buying into it, rates constantly rise, and there is so much work), i stated that the platform is ever growing.

    And yep a major prob for me is search engines but i have every confidence that as the platform grows, the serahc engine problem would have to be address.

    The problem is indexing content. In what way could users abuse a system that index content inside swf's correctly, whether it be dynamic or static content?
    Tink

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  7. #47
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    Hi All,

    For indexing sites on search engines, maybe we should adopt a ROI XML file type of solution. The ROI (ATOM) file discribes the content of the Flash Site.

    Cheers

    Carl
    [::TILL THE END::]

    P.S How do you setup your Avatar? I haven't got the option to change from no image under edit Avatar. Mod's please help.

  8. #48
    Actionscript 3, postproduction georgecalgary's Avatar
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    Google could search Adobe PDF, words and lots of other format. For Flash it wouldn't be a big problem for searching later as it's open format, while you see you could decompile text with Flare easily. All text variables are there.
    The only problem is that there's few full Flash sites with important informations, so why Google have to search it?

  9. #49
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    The only problem is that there's few full Flash sites with important informations, so why Google have to search it?
    Hi Geogrecalgary,

    There 'aint that many sites of any kind that are of important information on the web. lol

    Cheers

    Carl
    ==========================================
    DEV WITH TO MUCH TIME ON HIS HANDS.


  10. #50
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    Hi Tink,

    Please, PLEASE, PLEASE mate, have a look at my other posting under XML. I checked out your site and noticed you know how to do RSS feeds and my problem is getting Flash to correctly loop through my XML file (its treating a Array like a String).

    http://www.flashkit.com/board/showthread.php?t=656005

    Cheers

    Carl
    ==========================================
    DEV WITH TO MUCH TIME ON HIS HANDS.


  11. #51
    Flash, Mans greatest invention
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    the thing is with html sites we saw text the same coulor as the background all this kind of stuff.

    With flash you have the ability to do that put the stuff off stage mask the text comment it out so much stuff that would make it really really hard to be indexed because it would be so easy to abuse the other thing is putting 50 swf on a site with good content for indexing all of this stuff and much much more would be really hard to search engines not to be abused by.

  12. #52
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    Hi Guys,

    Do you know about ROI? Why Macromedia couldn't do something like it that is useful for search engines? I think ROI is finally a decent way for web masters to setup there page listings quickly and correctly.

    Cheers

    Carl
    ==========================================
    DEV WITH TO MUCH TIME ON HIS HANDS.


  13. #53
    Actionscript 3, postproduction georgecalgary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlosbrunos
    Hi Geogrecalgary,
    There 'aint that many sites of any kind that are of important information on the web. lol
    Cheers
    Carl
    Documents in PDF/DOC format are always something important for lots of people, because they're always edit seriously. So Google try to search them with additional effort, while Flash another different.

  14. #54
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    im dissapointed too

    I'm really dissapointed at the moment with 8

    7 was really good and faster i'm sure than 8 at getting xml when i can get it working.

    I spend too long trying to understand the new security model.

    WHY CANT I TEST IN AUTHORING ENVIRONMENT with xml file capture via php and localhost? for example.

    we didnt need all the blur crap and look at the way one needs to use it at runtime! arrays of filter objects. yuk. has anyone tried animating it via code-could be simpler-thats what we want simplicity.
    what we all need is runtime binding improvments. and more reliability.
    sort out the security issues please -also upgrading the player resulted in an animation working on their site (the spinny thing) -when you can see the animation above its installed-nope version control. I cant seriously push some projects in flash now. The security embarasses and confuses me.

    m
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    A travel blog

    Landed At
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  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlosbrunos
    Hi All,

    I've been a web developer (ASP, .NET, Vb, etc..) for sometime now, and still Flash isn't what Macromedia promised to be for me.

    I remember going to Macromedia senimars (Flash MX) and being promised that the future of Flash would very much embrace web developers as well as designers. So far no luck.

    With 2004 Pro we finally got some decent XML methods to use, but still in fairness the player doesn't cut it (flash is slow at working through XML files).

    I've noticed that Macromedia seem to be pushing the new video capabilities for Flash 8, but there is barely no mention concerning data handling or developing. Whats happened to all those promises from years back??

    I feel that 4 years ago Flash was in prime position for dominating the web on every front, but has failed to grow over the years. How many e-commerce sites are in Flash (major sites that is), not even this web site is flash. Why?? The answer is simple, becuase Flash doesn't allow companies to develop web sites that are easy to build and maintain (using backend db's is critical to most (if not all) major web sites for holding data.).

    Anyway, I'll get off my soap box, let me know what you think.

    Cheers

    Carl
    [::TILL THE END::]

    Sorry to pitch in on this one a little late, but i have a few thoughts on this topic and especially your post.

    I've been a web developer (ASP, .NET, Vb, etc..) for sometime now, and still Flash isn't what Macromedia promised to be for me.
    What did Macromedia say Flash would be to you?

    I remember going to Macromedia senimars (Flash MX) and being promised that the future of Flash would very much embrace web developers as well as designers. So far no luck.
    Have you taken a look at Flex Builder 2 and Flash Player 8.5? Flash Player 8 was more of a release for the designers, it adds alot more creative possibilites, Flash Player 8.5 on the other hand, is more of a release for developers. It add's speed (lots of speed) and all the other developer features that we need, E4X, Regular Expressions, Binary Sockets and a standards based programming language (Actionscript 3).

    I've noticed that Macromedia seem to be pushing the new video capabilities for Flash 8, but there is barely no mention concerning data handling or developing. Whats happened to all those promises from years back??
    What kind of data handling are you speaking of? Again, this is probably catered for in the new version of the Flex Framework and/or Flex Enterprise Services.

    I feel that 4 years ago Flash was in prime position for dominating the web on every front, but has failed to grow over the years. How many e-commerce sites are in Flash (major sites that is)
    Mmmmm... which rock have you been hiding under? The web isnt just about e-commerce, but there are alot of highly interactive, engaging, rich media e-commerce sites on the web that take full advantage of the Flash Players capabilities.

    not even this web site is flash. Why?? The answer is simple, becuase Flash doesn't allow companies to develop web sites that are easy to build and maintain (using backend db's is critical to most (if not all) major web sites for holding data.).
    Disagree, if you build your site properly using object oriented programming and designer patterns and utilise Flash Remoting and/or XML for the data model you can build a site that is not only visually appealing and highly interactive, but also easily maintainable and scalable.

    My suggestion to you would be to do a little more research into the Flash Platform.

  16. #56
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    google

    I hope there's support for spiders to be able to access text (somehow) as this is still my major concern for using flash only websites these days.

    I heard that flex 2 will allow the player to upload binary files! great I wanted a neat image upload without going back to html (looks disjointed).

    The breeze presentation for me was confusing- im confused a lot these days!
    I did get 50% of it and now understand where things are going- a lot of it was marketed at technical business management I think.
    m
    ----------------------------
    A travel blog

    Landed At
    ----------------------------

  17. #57
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    Well I'm not sure if it works the other way around, but I know that the gang over at www.fantasy-interactive.com who do the roadrunner site have incorporated a Flash version of the Google search engine (working closely with Google to do it apparently) maybe they are working making it work the other way around now too??

    Also, I thought I read somewhere about how we can now add metatags to flash docs...or was that just flv's...can't remember but worth sifting through stuff again...

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