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Thread: I'm Norwegian and I have nothing against Islam

  1. #461
    Mundu emm_eye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by indivision
    why 4?

    I don't have all the knowledge to answer this question..

    but i guess it is so that all the 4 can be treated equally.. and a larger number might result in a not so good treatment of all..

    did some reasearch and found this article by a muslim scholar in india.. only if you are interested in reading..

    Question:

    Why is a man allowed to have more than one wife in Islam? i.e. why is polygamy allowed in Islam?

    Answer:

    1. Definition of Polygamy

    Polygamy means a system of marriage whereby one person has more than one spouse. Polygamy can be of two types. One is polygyny where a man marries more than one woman, and the other is polyandry, where a woman marries more than one man. In Islam, limited polygyny is permitted; whereas polyandry is completely prohibited.

    Now coming to the original question, why is a man allowed to have more than one wife?

    2. The Qur'an is the only religious scripture in the world that says,"marry only one".

    The Qur'an is the only religious book, on the face of this earth, that contains the phrase `marry only one'. There is no other religious book that instructs men to have only one wife. In none of the other religious scriptures, whether it be the Vedas, the
    Ramayan, the Mahabharat, the Geeta, the Talmud or the Bible does one find a restriction on the number of wives. According to these scriptures one can marry as many as one wishes. It was only later,
    that the Hindu priests and the Christian Church restricted the number of wives to one.

    Many Hindu religious personalities, according to their scriptures, had multiple wives. King Dashrat, the father of Rama, had more than one wife. Krishna had several wives.

    In earlier times, Christian men were permitted as many wives as they wished, since the Bible puts no restriction on the number of wives.
    It was only a few centuries ago that the Church restricted the number of wives to one.

    Polygyny is permitted in Judaism. According to Talmudic law, Abraham had three wives, and Solomon had hundreds of wives. The practice of polygyny continued till Rabbi Gershom ben Yehudah (960 C.E to 1030 C.E) issued an edict against it. The Jewish Sephardic communities living in Muslim countries continued the practice till as late as 1950, until an Act of the Chief Rabbinate of Israel extended the ban
    on marrying more than one wife.

    3. Hindus are more polygynous than Muslims

    The report of the `Committee of The Status of Woman in Islam', published in 1975 mentions on page numbers 66 and 67 that the percentage of polygamous marriages between the years 1951 and 1961 was 5.06% among the Hindus and only 4.31% among the Muslims.

    According to Indian law only Muslim men are permitted to have more than one wife. It is illegal for any non-Muslim in India to have more than one wife. Despite it being illegal, Hindus have more
    multiple wives as compared to Muslims. Earlier, there was no restriction even on Hindu men with respect to the number of wives allowed. It was only in 1954, when the Hindu Marriage Act was passed that it became illegal for a Hindu to have more than one wife. At
    present it is the Indian Law that restricts a Hindu man from having more than one wife and not the Hindu scriptures.

    Let us now analyse why Islam allows a man to have more than one wife.

    4. Qur'an permits limited polygyny

    As I mentioned earlier, Qur'an is the only religious book on the face of the earth that says `marry only one'. The context of this phrase is the following verse from Surah Nisa of the Glorious Qur'an:

    "Marry women of your choice, two, or three, or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one."

    [Al-Qur'an 4:3]

    Before the Qur'an was revealed, there was no upper limit for polygyny and many men had scores of wives, some even hundreds. Islam put an upper limit of four wives. Islam gives a man permission to marry two, three or four women, only on the condition that he deals justly with them.

    In the same chapter i.e. Surah Nisa verse 129 says:

    "Ye are never able to be fair and just as between women...." [Al-Qur'an 4:129]

    Therefore polygyny is not a rule but an exception. Many people are under the misconception that it is compulsory for a Muslim man to have more than one wife.

    Broadly, Islam has five categories of Do's and Don'ts:

    i. `Fard' i.e. compulsory of obligatory

    ii. `Mustahab' i.e. recommended or encouraged

    iii. `Mubah' i.e. permissible or allowed

    iv. `Makruh' i.e. not recommended or discouraged

    v. `Haraam' i.e. prohibited or forbidden

    Polygyny falls in the middle category of things that are
    permissible. It cannot be said that a Muslim who has two, three or four wives is a better Muslim as compared to a Muslim who has only one wife.

    5. Average life span of females is more than that of males

    By nature males and females are born in approximately the same ratio. A female child has more immunity than a male child. A female child can fight the germs and diseases better than the male child.
    For this reason, during the pediatric age itself there are more deaths among males as compared to the females.

    During wars, there are more men killed as compared to women. More men die due to accidents and diseases than women. The average life span of females is more than that of males, and at any given time one finds more widows in the world than widowers.

    6. India has more male population than female due to female foeticide and infanticide

    India is one of the few countries, along with the other neighbouring countries, in which the female population is less than the male population. The reason lies in the high rate of female infanticide
    in India, and the fact that more than one million female foetuses are aborted every year in this country, after they are identified as females. If this evil practice is stopped, then India too will have more females as compared to males.

    7. World female population is more than male population

    In the USA, women outnumber men by 7.8 million. New York alone has one million more females as compared to the number of males, and of the male population of New York one-third are gays i.e sodomites.
    The U.S.A as a whole has more than twenty-five million gays. This means that these people do not wish to marry women. Great Britain has four million more females as compared to males. Germany has five million more females as compared to males. Russia has nine million more females than males. God alone knows how many million more females there are in the whole world as compared to males.

    8. Restricting each and every man to have only one wife is not practical

    Even if every man got married to one woman, there would still be more than thirty million females in U.S.A who would not be able to get husbands (considering that America has twenty five million gays). There would be more than four million females in Great Britain, 5 million females in Germany and nine million females in Russia alone who would not be able to find a husband.

    Suppose my sister happens to be one of the unmarried women living in USA, or suppose your sister happens to be one of the unmarried women
    in USA. The only two options remaining for her are that she either marries a man who already has a wife or becomes public property.
    There is no other option. All those who are modest will opt for the first.

    In Western society, it is common for a man to have mistresses and/or multiple extra-marital affairs, in which case, the woman leads a disgraceful, unprotected life. The same society, however, cannot
    accept a man having more than one wife, in which women retain their honourable, dignified position in society and lead a protected life.

    Thus the only two options before a woman who cannot find a husband is to marry a married man or to become public property. Islam prefers giving women the honourable position by permitting the first
    option and disallowing the second.

    There are several other reasons, why Islam has permitted limited polygyny, but it is mainly to protect the modesty of women.

  2. #462
    I Mastered Dead Technology TallGuyLittleCar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerbick
    Just like there's an Anti-Semitism Law - an UN sanctioned one in fact - then place an equal one for Anti-Islamist as well.
    Does that mean the southpark guys can be taken to the hague for making fun of kyle? Anybody that riots or commits violence due to a cartoon or something said or printed needs a napalm shower.
    Last edited by TallGuyLittleCar; 02-10-2006 at 12:27 PM.
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  3. #463
    supervillain gerbick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TallGuyLittleCar
    Does that mean the southpark guys can be taken to the hague for making fun of kyle? Anybody that riots or commits violence due to a cartoon or something said or printed needs a napalm shower.
    now... here's where it's an act that regards actual threats, not parody.

    so this situation about the cartoon would be a tough call. thus my original comments... it's a cartoon. the reaction isn't the same, imho.

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  4. #464
    FK's Geezer Mod Ask The Geezer's Avatar
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    I don't have all the knowledge to answer this question..

    but i guess it is so that all the 4 can be treated equally.. and a larger number might result in a not so good treatment of all..

    did some reasearch and found this article by a muslim scholar in india.. only if you are interested in reading..
    Your missing the whole point of this question. Unless women are allowed to have 4 husbands also, they are being discriminated against.

    I mean aside from them not being taught to read, forced to wear certain clothes, not being allowed to earn their own money, work a job, vote, forced to marry some old coot they don't want.....
    Last edited by Ask The Geezer; 02-10-2006 at 01:29 PM.

  5. #465
    supervillain gerbick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ask The Geezer
    Your missing the whole point of this question. Unless women are allowed to have 4 husbands also, they are being discriminated against.
    Give it time. Hell, women couldn't vote not too long ago here in the states. Different society, different things, different timing.

    And the women in that area are gaining rights... there's just no Susan B. Anthony figure yet.

    And if you want to go the religious path for justification, according to the Baptist church, as well as most white supremacy organizations, via the Bible, the obscure statement that the sons of Ham, which was the son of Noah who saw him naked, disorderly and drunk were to be the "servants"... thus religious twisting of the words in a holy book to fit a need and reason to surpress somebody.

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  6. #466
    Retired SCORM Guru PAlexC's Avatar
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    I'm gonna go ahead and assume that gay polygamy is right out? That marriage is strictly between a man and several women?

    Thank you, don't forget to tip your waitress.
    "What really bugs me is that my mom had the audacity to call Flash Kit a bunch of 'inept jack-asses'." - sk8Krog
    ...and now I have tape all over my face.

  7. #467
    supervillain gerbick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PAlexC
    I'm gonna go ahead and assume that gay polygamy is right out? That marriage is strictly between a man and several women?

    Thank you, don't forget to tip your waitress.
    that whole Sodom and Gomorrah thing... it's in the Qu'ran too I believe.

    So nope... no gay multiple marriages. Just enough Bravo channel shows and Queer Eye for whatever you can rhyme with that as you see fit most likely.

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  8. #468
    FK's Geezer Mod Ask The Geezer's Avatar
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    who saw him naked, disorderly and drunk
    Been there, Done that...

  9. #469
    New Wave Visionray's Avatar
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    Actually I don't think that polygyny in Islamic countries shows oppression of women. Polygyny seems to also have biological factors, not just cultural. I don't think it stems from the fact that there are more women than men, but more to do with the fact that men provide protection in nearly every society. And why is that? Men had a head start on being in control, since in the early days brute force and strength was needed, which men have more of.

    These days it's not about a man being strong anymore, but financially sucessful. You are a good provider if you have cash. You don't have to be strong, you don't have to be good looking, just be rich and you will land a supermodel.

    So, a woman may often prefer to be the mistress, or second wife of a sucessful man, than the first wife of a chump loser. Biologically speaking, two things women care about are being protected and reproducing. Polygyny provides all that, and if emotions weren't involved, you could argue it's a more effective way to organize society. Look at our primate ancestry, none of them are monogomous by nature and neither are humans. Society has placed rules and moral codes on humans to remain monogomous.

    Having said that, there are plenty of other things that go on in the Muslim world, that appear as oppression in western eyes.
    Last edited by Visionray; 02-10-2006 at 03:48 PM.

  10. #470
    FK's Geezer Mod Ask The Geezer's Avatar
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    So, a woman may often prefer to be the mistress, or second wife of a sucessful man, than the first wife of a chump loser.
    Prefer is the key word here. And if she "prefers" to not get married at all, does she have a choice? No! Not from all I've read and understand.

    And please don't come back with "but not all muslims do that", [not you Visionray]. It's a lame crutch to use when so many do do it.

  11. #471
    Not PWD ViRGo_RK's Avatar
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    EDIT PAlexC took care of it.


    PAlexC: That's just Chuck Norris's way of saying sometimes corn needs to lay the heck down.
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  12. #472
    I Mastered Dead Technology TallGuyLittleCar's Avatar
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    In alot of arab nations, women are free not to cover their faces, or wear a scarf and can talk to almost whomever they wish. Alot of women choose to cover their faces.
    ONLY RON PAUL AND ALUMINUM FOIL CAN SAVE YOU NOW!
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    Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabris, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam.

  13. #473
    FK's Geezer Mod Ask The Geezer's Avatar
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    Alot of women choose to cover their faces.
    Probably a GOOD thing.

    Now that I think about it, more american cows, er, um, women, should do that too.

  14. #474
    Retired SCORM Guru PAlexC's Avatar
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    We need to work on midriff's and buttcracks first. For starters, it's always the wrong girls that dress like that. Second, in the summer, it's kinda sexy. In March, that makes you a desperate skank. Third, ladies, when I see your crack I don't think it's sexy. I think you look like a plumber.
    Last edited by PAlexC; 02-10-2006 at 04:06 PM.
    "What really bugs me is that my mom had the audacity to call Flash Kit a bunch of 'inept jack-asses'." - sk8Krog
    ...and now I have tape all over my face.

  15. #475
    I Mastered Dead Technology TallGuyLittleCar's Avatar
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    muffintop (n): role of fat hanging over low rise jeans.
    ONLY RON PAUL AND ALUMINUM FOIL CAN SAVE YOU NOW!
    annoy your politician fairtax.org, a political forum

    Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabris, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam.

  16. #476
    FK's Geezer Mod Ask The Geezer's Avatar
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    Queen Rania of Jordan does NOT wear a veil, she's on C-Span now, and I'd hit it.

  17. #477
    FK'n Elitist Super Mod EVPohovich's Avatar
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    I think I should "invade"...

  18. #478
    New Wave Visionray's Avatar
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    Some women choose to wear the veil while others don't like it. You could argue the ones that choose so are brainwashed. Or maybe not.

    I always thought it would be a good idea to do a spin-off on the Girls Gone Wild videos, called Afghani Girls Gone Wild, where they would get freaky, show a little bit of shoulder, perhaps some elbow.

    Just a joke, no offense to anyone. From their point of view westerners don't have the greatest morals, with our gambling, legal prostitution in some areas, massive porn industry, high divorce rates, drug culture, etc.

  19. #479
    Chaos silverx2's Avatar
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    they did that before.
    GhooooostGIrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrl
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  20. #480
    New Wave Visionray's Avatar
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    damn, oh well have to think of another series.
    This reminds me of when someone stole Gerbicks Redneckula idea.

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