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Thread: Elements. Fantasy cards game

  1. #1361
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    Quote Originally Posted by sixones View Post
    Now I have been winning atleast one card every other game.
    Upthread somebody said that the odds were the same as a spin against any other deck (~5% per spin). Are you just getting lucky, or is that guy wrong?

    I'll give it a try too.

  2. #1362
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    bug?

    element selection (for purposes of devourer, etc) appears to be unbiased - thus if i have 400 earth and 2 time, and the opponent has 2 devourers, he will pretty much all the time eat 1 of my time.

    on many levels it would have been more reasonable to factor the quantity into selection chance (so earth has 200x higher chance to be selected than time)

  3. #1363
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    Quote Originally Posted by r3h0ld3r View Post
    Well you've convinced me. I'll give the lvl six strategy a try with a mono aether and see what happens

    Mono-aether (the best) and a poison/aether I found to be the most effective.

    But if you are going to do the level 6 strategy---
    Before you start make sure you have a decent amount of investment money, and don't upgrade as soon as you get to 1500. Every now and then I go on a bad streak and waste a few hundred coins. And at one point I had 1600 coins and upgraded, then lost 3 more and I had to go back to selling cards that I wanted to keep just so I could continue playing.

  4. #1364
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    I've been farming the level 6s too, and getting 1 card every 2 games seems a tad high (although it might depend on which ones you're beating); I've had some serious droughts. You also need quite a bit of seed money or a whole lot of luck starting out, as it's easy to blow through a thousand gold without getting a card (but then you sometimes win several cards in a row quickly, which balances out). Still very decent profits as long as you can manage a 10% win rate or so.

    Mono-aether and gravity/light stall are both decent; they don't seem to consistently win against any specific gods, but they have an outside shot at a lot of different ones. I'm not sure that they can reliably win 10% of the time, but they're definitely close. Unfortunately, it looks like Morte got revamped which may be bad news for these two decks as it was one of the most vulnerable ones for them. It seems to do more direct poison which is problematic for stalling, and bonewall seems to be a bit more prominent as well.

    Haven't really tried fire/earthquake. Which gods does it work on?

    For the record, the main strategies I've tried are FFQ (can get some wins but getting 10% is very iffy I think), freeze/growth (possibly slightly more reliable than my FFQ but still very shaky), gravity/light (decent), earth/time denial (sort of decent), gravity/fire (didn't work for me), mono-aether (decent), and dive/parallel universe (has huge problems against most of the gods but can still pick up some random wins with enough luck, but it absolutely demolishes Miracle so there's your 10% right there).

    Morte (old version) and Fire Queen are both unreliable, so I've picked up wins against them with a lot of decks. Incarnate is also beatable but isn't as easy as Morte was. I've beaten Miracle with stallish tactics before although it can take a lot of luck since Miracle's Miracle makes it very hard to kill.

    I've squeaked out wins against Seism, Rainbow, and Gemini but these all took a lot of luck and I've yet to find anything that beats them with any consistency at all. Scorpio shuts down a lot of common strategies, but tailoring a deck to beat Scorpio might be an interesting yet doable challenge. Hermes and Graviton just demolish everything I throw at them, though.

  5. #1365
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    Quote Originally Posted by sixones View Post
    This way I am up to a 370 coin gain from every 20 games minimum it seems.
    (Obviously those less lucky may not get any cards)
    for a profit of 18.5 gold/game, or about the same i make vs playing level 3

  6. #1366
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    Quote Originally Posted by gorgonzola View Post
    Upthread somebody said that the odds were the same as a spin against any other deck (~5% per spin). Are you just getting lucky, or is that guy wrong?

    I'll give it a try too.
    I read over the 5% per spin and I figured I would only have had a 15% chance to get a card coming out of every other game. At first I thought I was just getting lucky with some of my wins, and then it became consistent through the (roughly?) 15-20 cards that I have won from it..

    Now, I could still just be getting really lucky? I have no idea.
    All I know is that I have found this level 6 strategy to be very profitable to me..

  7. #1367
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    Quote Originally Posted by zzz123 View Post
    for a profit of 18.5 gold/game, or about the same i make vs playing level 3
    Those are the odds I have been receiving considering that I never win 2 or 3 cards per win. (Which has happened 3 times so far..)

    Also you have to consider that lets say you are playing an aether for example, and you beat Gemini and win a rare card that you can add straight to your deck. That is a win that saves you 1500 coins.

  8. #1368
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    A definite downside to this strategy is that it completely screws over your score for the time being.

    But then again, you already would have had every quest for score completed and once you get enough upgraded cards it would be much much easier to just get it back up again.

  9. #1369
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    ..

  10. #1370
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    How many upgraded cards do you have before stepping into lvl 6? With a non-consistent number (0-2) i've got annihilated playing with either mono-aether, bone-poison, freeze-poison & FFQ. Un-upped mono-dark gets totally owned.

    Seems to me i'll have to pass countless hours grinding money before even stepping in the fun part of the game

    Imo we should attract more ppl to PvP: i can only find newbs in there with decks so ****ty that i'm starting to enjoy more an idiot AI with a consistent deck. Add the fact that in the time it passes waiting for my opponent i could play 2 other games, PvP is also non-profitable in terms of grinding.

  11. #1371
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    Quote Originally Posted by zanzarino View Post
    Just posting to let you know that I keep reading the forum and to answer to a few comments:

    Elo rating system:
    The way score rewards are calculated for a pvp match is similar to elo rating system; the entire elo rating system can not be applied to elements because, well, elements and chess are not the same game.

    Playing chess implies starting with the same board configuration for both players, elements does not, even separating the score in a skill based "rating" and a "score like it is right now" would not work (at all) because that system does not consider the advantage of having better cards.

    In fact, a rating system would be heavily unfair for new players, example:

    I am a new player, rating zero, I decide to start my first pvp match, and I get to play against "Pveguy", a player that loves to play against fake gods and today decided to try pvp as well, it is his first pvp game too, so his rating too is zero. Game starts, he has all updated cards, I have an almost-starter deck. He wins after 5 turns, the elo system kicks in, heavily drains on my ranking and heavily reward "pveguy". I am pissed, I think it was unfair that "Pveguy" had the same rating I had, I am going to send an email to zanzarino telling him that "pveguy" is a cheater and found a way to keep his ranking at zero to suck coins out of newbies and I am going to quit elements.
    Very well-reasoned response. I have nothing to disagree with there. It seems like there could be some sort of rating/scoring system that is more encouraging and reflective of success than the current system of playing countless matches to break into the top 50.

  12. #1372
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaythal View Post
    How many upgraded cards do you have before stepping into lvl 6? With a non-consistent number (0-2) i've got annihilated playing with either mono-aether, bone-poison, freeze-poison & FFQ. Un-upped mono-dark gets totally owned.
    Getting annihilated is par for the course; if you can reliably win 1 fight in 10, you're doing well. The fake gods are absolutely unforgiving; they bring out so much damage so quickly and carry such a diverse array of threats and counters that even if your deck has an advantage on paper everything still has to go just right in order for you to beat their HP before they beat yours. One upgraded card probably isn't going to make much of a difference if you don't already have a decent deck; you won't even see it half the time.

    Thus I would strongly recommend not upgrading anything; save your 1500 gold and spend in to fight 50 times. If you've got a workable deck in hand this should be enough to win at least one card, which you can sell off for more seed money. Keep trucking along in this manner, tweaking your deck if necessary, and eventually you'll hit the jackpot--then it's time to upgrade, maybe.

    I've never tried poison but I'm not sure I see it being a good idea; I don't think there's any way you're ever going to be able to reliably stall long enough to deal 200 damage through poison (at least with a non-upgraded deck). Mono-aether is definitely workable although it takes very good draws to work and most of the level 6 decks can kill your shield if you're unlucky; I advise going pure pillar/dragon/shield, as the gods bring out too many creatures too quickly for you to shut them down with lightning bolt.

    I was managing to eke out a tiny profit with FFQ but it seems really shaky in this environment. Make sure you include at least 5 empathic bonds--I wouldn't normally put in that many for a PvP deck as it slows my setup down too much, but there's not much point in trying to outrun the level 6 enemies for damage so try to stall them instead.

    (EDIT: Incidentally, I think I must have mis-remembered earlier when I said I hadn't beat Hermes; I just managed to squeeze out a win against him, barely, and seeing his cards on the slot machine makes me think I had done it once before too. Still, Hermes is a gigantic pain; he brings out ridiculous amounts of damage and can easily destroy creatures and permanents, then if all else fails he's quite happy firebolting you to death through whatever defense you have set up.)
    Last edited by ggabriel; 08-05-2009 at 05:44 PM.

  13. #1373
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaythal View Post
    How many upgraded cards do you have before stepping into lvl 6?
    I had 0 when I first went in.

    Now I have 11 =) In 1 day.

    Only thing I havn't beaten with mono aether is Gravity and Miracle

    (Just beat Scorpio in the LUCKIEST possible way ever, he is beatable as Aether -.-)

  14. #1374
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    Guess I'm not the only one having trouble with Graviton. Miracle is beatable with mono-aether, but you need very good draws and you're almost definitely going to lose if he actually casts Miracle.

    Come to that, most of them can potentially be beaten with mono-aether, the trouble is that it takes a lot of luck not to get shut down. Miracle and Fire Queen are the only ones that dimension shield will reliably save you against and they both have a tendency to heal away all your damage. Mono-aether still wins often enough to profit at least a little, though, and if you stick with it you can probably up your success rate a bit by upgrading.

    (Hmmmmmmm... I think my earth/time deck might actually have a shot at Graviton. He has a fire mark but all his creatures are gravity, so if you can shut him down early and reverse whatever creatures he gets out that just might work. It sounds iffy as hell, but it's a better shot than anything else I can think of. I'm tempted to try it out once I build up my buffer some more.)
    Last edited by ggabriel; 08-05-2009 at 06:01 PM.

  15. #1375
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    Quote Originally Posted by ggabriel View Post
    Miracle is beatable with mono-aether, but you need very good draws and you're almost definitely going to lose if he actually casts Miracle.



    Miracle and Fire Queen are the only ones that dimension shield will reliably save you against and they both have a tendency to heal away all your damage.

    Miracle consistently heals himself back to 199 health 3-4 a game whenever I play against it.

    Also I do very well against Seism, as he does not kill my dimension shields. I just wait as long as possible to play them and hope I can get up a few dragons up early. And I never play more than 2 pillars unless I jump from 2 to 5 suddenly. Also playing 1 pillar on the first turn, as he almost always has an earthquake in his hand at the begginning.

  16. #1376
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    Oh yeah, forgot Seism can't get through shield either. Still, I kind of question mono-aether's ability to beat him reliably. It takes luck to draw enough shields to last long for the kill (even considering his offense is often slow, buying you a couple extra turns at the start), it takes luck to draw enough early pillars to build up the stockpile you need, and it takes luck for those pillars not to just get quicksanded into oblivion no matter what you do. If he puts up diamond shield (and he often will) that cuts your attack by 2/3, slowing down your offense and making it even more likely that something else will go wrong before you can kill him.

    Now once you get some upgrades rolling, though, maybe then I could see it going places as every bit of quantum helps here, but otherwise I have a hard time believing you'd reliably win even 10% of the fights against Seism.
    Last edited by ggabriel; 08-05-2009 at 06:22 PM.

  17. #1377
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    Since when did we have open chat?

  18. #1378
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    Quote Originally Posted by sixones View Post
    Since when did we have open chat?
    Since version 1.0 it has been linked to on the page, since version ~0.3 it had been at the bottom of the Elements game page... :-D


    --rob77dp
    Last edited by rob77dp; 08-05-2009 at 06:23 PM. Reason: too early on the submit post button!

  19. #1379
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    Quote Originally Posted by ggabriel View Post
    time believing you'd reliably win even 10% of the fights against Seism.
    I win about 20% of my fights with him.. one of my easier fights...

    Of course not as easy as Incarnation...

  20. #1380
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob77dp View Post
    Since version 1.0 it has been linked to on the page, since version ~0.3 it had been at the bottom of the Elements game page... :-D


    --rob77dp
    Never noticed it lol..

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