Gun Control

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Originally Posted by MagnusVS

The statistic discussed in this thread, seems to show some correlation.

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And other countries high possession rate and low crime rate shows no correlation. So, pretending that the US and UK are the only statistics to look at is not representative of a correlation using all relevant data. By the logic of just going by the US and UK, you could say that a single shooting event shows a correlation that guns must be the cause of all murder.

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Originally Posted by MagnusVS

When it comes to Canada, do you think there can more hunting rifles and less hand guns?

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I'm not sure. I'm also not sure why that would matter? According to the behavior aspect of the theories thrown out here, existence of guns cause crime because people just get mad and lose control. Are you saying that criminals object to using rifles for their crimes? do you think "young kids" or "teenagers" have no interest in rifles but do in handguns?

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Originally Posted by FlashLackey

no on the waiting period. it has not been shown to have a positive effect.

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Surely a waiting period would serve two purposes: enable a comprehensive background check, and allow a "cooling off" period - even if debatable it's not the main purpose anyway.

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no on the number of guns. not sure what the point of that would be.

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Hmmm.... Though what is the point of allowing unlimited firearms? After the first, oh, ten or so, would you not wonder why that creapy guy down the road is having boxes of guns delivered daily? I don't know, even for a gun "nut", I would figure 10 guns was a pretty reasonable number. With those requiring more for "special purposes" able to apply for permission?

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the calibre. mostly not. but, obviously, there should be some line drawn when it comes to bazookas, rocket launchers, etc. that should be decided by the state.

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How big a gun do you need to "protect" the family?
Once you're agreeing to any kind of calibre, then there is room for debate to what level.

you know Switzerland has about 60% of the murders that the u.k. does.. which has only 33% of the murders that the u.s. does.

Clearly the u.s. and the u.k. need to have 20% of the households armed with fully automatic assault rifles.

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Originally Posted by TheOriginalFlashDavo

Actually, the common factor is more often than not anyone with a viewpoint outside the "norm" in here. Observed this behaviour in threads I've had nadda to do with, and goes back over a number of years with folk who don't post here no more for that very reason.

So who was it that came out with the following merely due to a similar thread o discussion that has happened the last page or so:

"All of you.....**** it.....turds......pointing a finger at us need to stand down."

Yep, all my fault I guess for the thread spiralling into the abyss. :rolleyes:



(sorry TGLG, that might derail our conversation a little. Apologies, just in the mood to let the devil out today and not let sleeping dogs lie...)

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Politics aside.....mine, yours, or anyone else's.....follow the rules of Flash Kit or be gone. It's simple. Keep your arguments to topics and not attacking members as you have with me. Each and every time you have quoted me it has been to attack me. The fact of the matter is you can do nothing. Nada! Zip! Nil! Not one damn thing. I can vote, I can change things, I can shape the world. What can you do? Nada! Zip! Nil! Not one damn thing. Oh wait, you can ***** like a whiney little child, I almost forgot. Even your "military" is a joke. And your country tops the world homicide rate, including second in firearms, and FIRST in all others. Looks like your time would be better spent cleaning up your own country than worrying about mine. </defendingLikeDavo>

Learn a lesson here, now, or you will be gone. Have you opinion, spew your dislike for my country, but follow the damn rules.

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Originally Posted by TheOriginalFlashDavo

IF it came to pass that the apparent majority got their way, what "tighter" gun laws would you suggest?

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1 month wait. criminal background check. I still would not implement a medical background check though.. to much of a slippery slope. If i was ell supremo president I would consider giving up handguns for true assault rifles.

but I don't think either would have any real effect on gun crimes.

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Originally Posted by TheOriginalFlashDavo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_pol...United_Kingdom

Figures here show a rise and then a fall. And some of the numbers quoted per year are so small that annual rises and falls in percentage seem much higher than in real numbers.

Between 1998/99 and 2005/06, there have been only two fatal shootings of police officers in England and Wales. Over the same period there were 107 non-fatal shootings of police officers - an average of just 9.7 per year.

And a view through the history of gun control on that page suggest that gun laws were well and truly in place for many types well before the 1997 handgun ban.

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Since 1998 number of people injured by firearms in England and Wales has more than doubled.

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Originally Posted by FlashLackey

And other countries high possession rate and low crime rate shows no correlation. So, pretending that the US and UK are the only statistics to look at is not representative of a correlation using all relevant data. By the logic of just going by the US and UK, you could say that a single shooting event shows a correlation that guns must be the cause of all murder.

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I think the main thing that many outside the US find strange (though with politics as it is maybe not so much) is that despite the HUGE gun violence issues that the US has, serious review of gun laws in an attempt to at least try something just hasn't really occurred. I mean, it's one thing to look at the stats and point out a lack of correlation about any argument someone is making from other countries, but surely one day - some day - something needs to be tried?

I think that's the main thing that boggles most of us outside the US, the lack of trying something to seriously address the issue.

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Originally Posted by EVP

I can shape the world.

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Correction, you can help shape America, not the world.
However after 7 pages I agree this threads gone way beyond pointless, people are falling out and writing obscene stuff in their footers ;) A little thread on Flashkit isn't going to change American politics.

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Originally Posted by FlashLackey

And other countries high possession rate and low crime rate shows no correlation. So, pretending that the US and UK are the only statistics to look at is not representative of a correlation using all relevant data.

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Except from Canada, there seems to be a general tendency with lower murder rates and less guns. But of course, there's probably many factors (including mental health care).

I would say it's easier to kill (many) people if you have an uzi or automatic handgun than if you have a hunting rifle that you have to reload every 2nd shot.

But I'm going to bed now. Good night and don't write to much while I'm asleep!;)

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Originally Posted by TheOriginalFlashDavo

I think that's the main thing that boggles most of us outside the US, the lack of trying something to seriously address the issue.

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the thing that boggles me is that people seem to think guns are making people kill each other.

Gun laws have shown not to have any effect on murder rates. So why keep going down that path? Look at the u.s. over a 100 year period and look at what is happening when murder rates climb and fall. It has nothing to do with guns.

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Originally Posted by EVPohovich

Learn a lesson here, now, or you will be gone. Have you opinion, spew your dislike for my country, but follow the damn rules.

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So I trust you will follow those rules too in the future?

You didn't in that post for example.

I have no qualms following the stated rules and guidelines, but do have some issue when Mods put in place to inforce said rules and guidelines don't actually follow them themselves.

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Originally Posted by tidenburg

people are falling out and writing obscene stuff in their footers ;)

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Merely the little power I have as a mere user rather than a Mod. Far more "obscene" stuff a few pages back, and still on this page too now unfortunately.

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Originally Posted by FlashLackey

Since 1998 number of people injured by firearms in England and Wales has more than doubled.

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In 2005/06, 87% of such injuries were defined as "slight," which includes the use of firearms as a threat only.

30-15. ;)

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Originally Posted by TallGuyLittleCar

the thing that boggles me is that people seem to think guns are making people kill each other.

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Fair enough, you have as much right to be "boggled" as we do.

Oh, sorry, and I did almost miss THIS little gem:

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Originally Posted by EVPohovich

Even your "military" is a joke. And your country tops the world homicide rate, including second in firearms, and FIRST in all others. Looks like your time would be better spent cleaning up your own country than worrying about mine. </defendingLikeDavo>

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So what country exactly do you think I come from?

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Originally Posted by tidenburg

Correction, you can help shape America, not the world.
However after 7 pages I agree this threads gone way beyond pointless, people are falling out and writing obscene stuff in their footers ;) A little thread on Flashkit isn't going to change American politics.

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Although I'm not a "You'd better worship America because it's greater than you" kind of person, America, as the most powerful nation in the world, has a big impact and precedent on other nations. And if you can help control the shark, you can help control the krill.

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Originally Posted by TheOriginalFlashDavo

http://www.atlanticfreepress.com/content/view/1403/81/

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Not sure if anyone has commented on this article yet, haven't read the last few pages but...

Dave, it's a nice idea in theory but doesn't make much sense when you think about it.

You need to go through all the driving tests, learner's permit etc.. for driving a car to prove that you CAN drive a car, that's pretty much it. So if the same was applied to gun laws, you'd be taking test to prove that you are ABLE to use a gun.

The fact that you would be "licensed" to be able to use a gun doesn't prevent you from using that gun to kill someone, it just proves you know how to shoot. I think the VT shooter would have passed a supposed gun "license" test with flying colors, he was obviously a very good shot.

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Originally Posted by TheOriginalFlashDavo

Merely the little power I have as a mere user rather than a Mod. Far more "obscene" stuff a few pages back, and still on this page too now unfortunately.

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yeah i did that like 8 months ago. then i grew up.

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Originally Posted by TheOriginalFlashDavo

So I trust you will follow those rules too in the future?

You didn't in that post for example.

I have no qualms following the stated rules and guidelines, but do have some issue when Mods put in place to inforce said rules and guidelines don't actually follow them themselves.

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Do not presume to tell me my position here at Flash Kit. That was me doing to you what you have done most of this thread (and a few recent others). Would you look at a Highway Patrol Officer and say "We'll you had to speed to catch me..."? No, As I have stated before, follow the rules, that's from me to you, a SuperModerator to a Member.

And you also seem to forget about the back to back to back (and so on) postings, another activity looked down upon here on this Forum.

Notice how all the other wide and varying soapbox shouters are not getting my attention? That should tell you something.

Your opinions are welcome, your attitude is not. Get with the program or the program will get along without you. This is the last warning, from here on out my action will be swift.


~EVP

Holy cow! The "Maximum Quote Per Thread" alarm just went off! :yikes: Scared the crap out of me.