StatsQuote:
Originally Posted by FlashLackey
Are
Being
Applied
Incorrectly.
Period.
StatsQuote:
Originally Posted by FlashLackey
Are
Being
Applied
Incorrectly.
Period.
he made the right call. End of discussion.
In a different time and place, you might be right. In that situation it was not the right call. End of discussion.
against the colts, with the chance to end the game, it was the right call.
get 2 yards and win.
i guess you know more about the situation then he did though, what with all your superbowl rings.
fixed.Quote:
Originally Posted by silverx2
here let me give you a list of times it would be ok.
vs the giants go ahead and punt it Eli is a little ***** and wont drive the field
Vs the colts go for it, get 2 yards and win the game, otherwise peyton has the tools to get the win
Vs the saints go for it, Drew brees is insane go for the win
vs the vikings Punt it, Favre will throw an interception
Vs every other team in the NFL punt it,
Hmmm...12 plays, 83 yards, 2:07, TD pass. SB XLII win.Quote:
Originally Posted by silverx2
well if a little ***** like Eli can do it, surely peyton can.
Hook line and sinker, i ****ing win, and you ****ing lose.
Something tells me there are personal feelings leaking into this thread...
Seems to me you lost both of the games in question...Quote:
Originally Posted by silverx2
seems to me that you don't understand that i honestly don't care what you think.
The patriots made the right call to go for it on 4 and 2, nothing you say changes my opinion.
..since they lost the game, you are correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by silverx2
im glad you think so. They had the chance to lose both ways. the only way to guarantee they win the game is to go for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
Please stop talking now.
agreed.Quote:
Originally Posted by silverx2
You can write that statement in haiku form and it will still only be an assertion.Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
Why are you afraid to answer my simple question?
Do you acknowledge that, without the nuances not covered by the statistics, Belichick's decision was correct?
I could have told you that after your first post.Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
@FL -
Why are you afraid to speak your mind and not rehash the thoughts of others? Go back and re-read every one of my posts. All are spoken as a football fan, not a Giants fan or a Pats hater. As I said, I actually complimented the Pats team and, more specifically, their Defense of the last decade.
Your question is ridiculous, b/c the scenario is not black and white. The environment was hostile, the situation was not dire (until they missed the 4th down play) and there was no reason not to punt there. You can blow up all of the nonsensical statistics you want...stats ONLY make sense when all things are equal and you have a sterile environment. This one was not one. This one was very very different. Why didn't you answer to my comment about Tom Landry?
You do this to everyone on this forum. You choose to find one piece of data in a statement which you want to pick apart in order to negate the entire theory. I'm sorry you didn't make it through to law school or whatever the reason is that your online persona comes off like that, but I am not going to sit here and allow you to make up for your shortcomings here and now. I am going to call you out 100% of the time.
I assure you that I am speaking my mind. What do you think I want to say that I haven't?Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
I think you've indicated your feelings about the Patriots clearly in posts like this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
This statement is ridiculous because a question doesn't declare any of the things that you are attaching to it. It's a simple question. I'm not saying that the environment wasn't hostile or that the situation wasn't dire, etc. I'm just trying to establish what we agree on.Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
According to the field position, downs, to-go distance, etc. that is covered by the statistics, do you acknowledge that it favors going for it? I'm not asking you to give up your theory about nuances.
And I didn't answer your comment about Tom Landry because it was a comment. Are all comments supposed to be answered the same way that questions are? What do you want to know about my position on Tom Landry?
I'm not trying to negate your theory with a question. How is that even possible? If your theory is sound, you should be able to answer questions that are related to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
I'm sorry that you have to make up for the shortcomings of your reason by resorting to personal insults. But, it's ok. I'm used to you doing that over the years.
It's not clear to me what you think you're calling me out on. Nothing you have written demonstrates anything more concrete than your personal assertion. I have provided statistics and math that support my position. I have never wanted to be a lawyer, if that is what you think you're calling me out on?
Do you feel called out yourself and are trying to turn the tables or something?
So... was the game enjoyable for you as well?
Don't get into NFL as much as NCAA. But, I still enjoy just about any football. Sure.
I didn't get to see this one live. But, I usually root against the Patriots. So, it was a good result for me. :)
Oh, I'm sorry.
I was throwing a question out there in the middle of this argument storm... the "you" was plural.
I still cannot see your posts unless I enable them FL.
I see.
Didn't know that you had turned my posts off. Amusing.
I'll keep that in mind next time I see one of your posts after mine.
First off, quoting something this old is a bit stalkerish, but ok...Quote:
Originally Posted by me
Secondly, I don't see how you find this statement above to equating me as a Pats hater. I told you - I don't like Belichick. I think he's an arrogant prick. I also think Brady is overrated (compared to Peyton Manning.) Do I think he'll go down as one of the all time greats? Yes. Do I think he gets there without the perfectly well rounded supporting cast? Not even close. Again, that being said, the statement above in no way supports your label of Pats hater on me. I was digging the stick (if I recall correctly) over the mis-step in the pre-assumed undefeated NFL season. That sh*t was so over-assumed that everyone forgot rule #1 in the NFL.
On any given Sunday...
On that particular Sunday, a defeat was in the cards. On that day, the Patriots were, without a doubt (Boston notwithstanding) the most hated team in America. That is truth.
@ Gerbs - How do I turn his posts off too?
So, you're still afraid to answer a simple question related to your theory?Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
So much for "succeeding brilliantly."
If I asked you in 1835
"Should we have a black president?"
Then I ask you the same question in 2007. Is there a situational difference? Can I apply statistics to the SAME question? Stop asking me nonsense.
Here's some more statistics for you...
If football is a game of inches (which it is most of the time) why would you choose to give
36 (inches per yard) * 45 (net punting yards) = 1,620 inches to Peyton and crew instead of making them earn it?
@ gerbs - still waiting on that turn off button...
I've not changed that from the last time I announced it. I tend to do what I state.
HR: Top left of the site, locate User CP > Edit Ignore List > (input) Name > Save Changes > Enjoy
what you guys dont realize is that Ratty is a superbowl winning coach and he knew exactly all the factors that were going on when BB made the choice he did.
So the answer is yes, you are still afraid to answer a simple question that relates to your theory.Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
I have to conclude that you have little confidence in your ability to defend your theory against basic scrutiny.
Nobody made that choice. The choice was to go for it and if they failed to retain some chance of stopping a short drive. Added together, the chances of either of those outcomes is better than stopping the Colts on a longer drive, based on statistical averages.Quote:
Originally Posted by hanratty21
Sounds good. I must have missed when you announced it.Quote:
Originally Posted by gerbick
That must be it.Quote:
Originally Posted by silverx2
After knowing hanratty for a while, one has to realize that he is also a bank CEO, linguistics professor and deep-sea diver when the situation requires it. No need for him to actually explain or defend his arguments. Just take his word for it on all subjects because he IS the authority! :D
If this was any other coach, this wouldnt even be a debate. But since it's Brilliant Bill, with his outside of the box thinking, he gets the benefit.
Oh and silver, Favre would not have thrown an interception. He would have won the game. Look at his stats. 107.5 rating with 17 TDs and only 3 INTs. Better than Brady and Manning.
Ci you will eat the words, just like the jets and packers fans before you.
...and Brees probably WOULD have thrown the INT, as he's got 6 TD's, 7 INT's in the last 4 weeks.
All math aside, and whether or not it was a statistically "correct" call to make...I'm seriously doubting Belichick took ANY of that into consideration when making that call.
Belichick made that call because he's an arrogant douchebag. It's just like 2 years ago when the Pats where throwing 4th down bombs to the endzone on their own 20 yard line while being up +30 points. That's the kind of team the Pats are, they like to cheat and they like to run up the score.
Hey visionray, ill give you $20 if you can provide one ****ing solid real time they did that 2 years ago.
I watched Every game and not a single ****ing time did they throw a bomb on 4th down from their own 20 while ahead.
Stop being a whiney little *****.
The patriots are a team that plays to win the game. They dont play for ratings, or to get tom brady 500 different advertising campaigns they play to win games. so cry more please.
I think Visionray may not have the facts 100% straight, but...
http://www.boston.com/sports/footbal...ess/?page=fullQuote:
Originally Posted by Tom Brady
Where in the **** have you been!?Quote:
Originally Posted by Visionray
It seems like most people didn't give him the benefit of the doubt and criticized the call.Quote:
Originally Posted by creativeinsomnia
If I hadn't read further analysis first, I think my own knee-jerk reaction would be to assume it was a bad call as well.
You're probably right that Belichick didn't calculate it down to a final number. But, I'm pretty sure that those guys are familiar with basic situational percentages the same way texas hold'em players know the odds of hitting a flush card with two to draw, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Visionray
I think he's a cheater. But, I don't get the impression that he's arrogant. How would that call make him arrogant? Manning had two long TD drives from the place he would have kicked to in the same quarter already. Why not give your offense a shot to seal the win on one short-yardage play instead of a defense on it's heels?
Boise State beat Oklahoma in the Fiesta Bowl by making the 2 point conversion. Everyone seemed to think that was brilliant. What Belichick did was similar in a lot of ways.
I love how you guys all label him a cheater as if what he did had any real impact on the game what so ever.
If he's a cheater, he's not a good one. Last Super Bowl, lost. The game in question... loss.
So... I'll just chalk it all up to bad execution.
Well. Cheating is cheating whether it works or not, right? What is more substantial to me is whether or not you know what you are doing is against the rules. I think he did.Quote:
Originally Posted by silverx2
which team do you root for again FL?
I know the answer is going to be something on the fence like "i dont really see the need to be a fan of one team i just like football in general, I like college football more, but again i like all of the teams except the patriots"