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Am I the only one having difficulties with video?
It seems that the embed video only works with small files, which is fine since most of my stuff is web, but when I link to a large .mov file nothing shows up in the flash player?
I'm debating on talking my co-workers into creating our next company promotional cd entirely with Flash MX. The only hitch has been the lack of video support in prior flash versions. We would be incorporating large video files on a hybrid cd. Any suggestions...
I just imported a 15 minute Mpg file into one scene of a multimedia cd that I am creating.. It takes forever and a day.. but it works, sound works, etc....
It added over 8000 frames to my scene... so be prepared for a big file... my projector file for this project is 300 mb...
hope that helped.
Well, if you're deploying on CD I would just ship everything as a projector. You don't have an content that NEEDS to be in a browser, right? So screw it. Commit to MX for standalones.
How big is big. I'm working on a CDROM project for a client also and I was able to embed a 90 meg quicktime (approx 2 and 1/2 minutes of video). But I did run into a bizarre problem. I'm working on a Mac. When I imported the video in OS 9.22 I kept getting an error message in Flash that I didn't have enough memory, even when I allocated Flash 400 Megs. When I tried again in OS 10.1 everything went smoothly and it took all of 10 minutes.
I should also note, before I embedded the video, I dumped it from Final Cut into Cleaner and compressed it with Sorenson 3. From what I've been seeing on the boards this seems to work the best.
First off you can't link to a .mov file unless you are outputing to quicktime, this isn't a swf or projector feature. I've gotten alot of video in Flash, but you need to compress it if it's going to be long. The best way to to do this is with Sorenson's Squeeze for flash. http://www.sorenson.com It works great and makes beautiful and small files. You could also check into Flix 2.1 at http://www.wildforms.com they both have their advantages.
[Edited by creativepointe on 03-27-2002 at 01:43 PM]
I have found that if the video is compressed with sorenson 3 it will give you out of memory errors on Mac os 9. Even with 600M assigned to Flash MX.
If you take the same video and compress it with Cinpak and 100 quality it will be a larger file but import fine.
I am currently dealing with the same issuse of using Flash's new video capabilities on CD-ROM. Am creating for a 50 mb card and I am using Sorenson Squeeze for the PC to create a .flv file to import into my Flash movie. If you want to make a Hybrid Mac PC compatible and you are worried about file size then don't import your video directly into your main Flash movie. If you are creating a PC and a Mac Projector file then you will in actuality have 2 copies of that video on the CD. You need to make a separate .swf file that contains your video. Then have the projector files call for that 1 swf file. The 2 projectors(hqx and exe) can both then share the video.
WILDFORM RELEASES FLIX 2.1 – FEATURING FLASH MX VIDEO
Wildform is pleased to announce the release of Flix 2.1, which features Flash MX (Flash version 6) video output. This makes Flix the only software that outputs all types of Flash video: the new, high quality Flash MX video, the ubiquitous Flash 3-5 video, and Flix’s one-of-a-kind vector video.
MX video uses high quality video compression that is comparable to Quicktime, Windows Media Player, and Real. Flix offers both 1-pass and 2-pass VBR MX video encoding. [Note: MX video output plays only in the Flash 6 player.]
Flix still outputs Flash 3-5 video (according to a December, 2001 NPD Research study, 98.3% of all Web users have Flash 3-5 installed), as well as its unique vector video that consists only of lines and curves defined by mathematical equations that can scale to any size without distortion (Flix’s vector video plays in any Flash player 3-6).
Flix also outputs many additional files, such as audio only files, projectors, and html code, and it comes loaded with many time saving features (such as batch, bandwidth control, links, play controls and variables) designed to enable users to encode video, add their own customized elements and post it on the web in minutes.
Flix 2.1 is $129, and each license also includes $100 in video from the Wildform Video Library as well as access to Wildform’s customer only resource section.
Flix 2.1 is available for Windows. Mac version due out within a week.
To buy Flix 2.1 (Win) go to:
www.wildform.com/buy
To download a demo a Flix 2.1 (Win) go to:
http://<a rel="nofollow" href="http:...s/cnet.php</a>
To view Flix’s MX video samples and for more information on Flix 2.1, check out:
http://www.wildform.com/flix/index.php
Flix 2.1 feature list:
http://www.wildform.com/flix/features_flix.php
Flix 1.x license holders can upgrade to Flix 2.1 for $30 here:
http://www.wildform.com/videolibrary...code_enter.php
Flix 2.0 license holders can upgrade for free to Flix 2.1 here:
http://www.wildform.com/flix/download/index.php
Have questions about Flix 2.1 and Flash MX (Flash 6)?
http://www.wildform.com/flix/flix_and_flash.php
jb
I just downloaded the Flix 2.1 Demo... There is an obvious reason why Flix is less expensive than Sorenson Squeeze. The quality of video compressed with Sorenson Squeeze is far superior for both image and audio. I compressed a video with both products at the same settings (as close as they allow) and the video from squeeze is clean and clear and the video from Flix came out grainy and lined with tinny audio. The other factor is that I saw no place to output a .flv file from Flix. That is an important advantage of Squeeze. Yes MX video is only playable in Flash Player 6 and Squeeze cannot make a swf file that can play in a lower version of Flash Player where as Flix can make video that is playable in version 3-6. Flix though creates swf files that are large and use more RAM than regular video might need. I have used Flix v1 in a couple of projects for CD and it did the job so I didn't have to go through with using Director. I am not in any way trying to say that Flix is obsolete now that Flash can handle real video but I am saying that for those who are using the new tools in MX will end up finding that a product like Sorenson Squeeze will do much better. Enjoy
Hi.
We have done several tests ourselves and the quality of Flix's Flash MX output is comparable to Sorenson Squeeze. And we back that up with a 15 day money back guarantee - something that Sorenson does not offer.
There are a number of issues involved.
1. MX defaults to 2-pass encoding. Flix defaults to 1-pass (because it's faster). So if you use the 1-pass, chances are your video won't look as good.
2. The Flix demo puts in a watermark (for obvious reasons). This watermark adds size to the file and slightly distorts the image because of the nature of the MX video compression. The full version of the software does a much better job. We are working on an alternative. But until then, the best way to check out what Flix output really looks like is to view the sample videos on our site at www.wildform.com - click on the MX video jukebox link. As you will see, Wildform has included many sample videos encoded at multiple bitrates (unlike Sorenson's website which has very few demos).
- Flix defaults to lower audio bitrate settings, which can easily be increased, if you want better audio quality. Since Flix and Squeeze both use mp3 audio, the audio output is essentially identical.
- Flix output swf's, whether they are MX or Flash 3-5 are not larger and do not use up any more ram than Sorenson Squeeze (of course Squeeze can not output Flash 3-5 video). The Flix Flash 3-5 video uses advanced memory management to prevent ram problems.
- And of course, Flix comes loaded with features, from vector video output, to automated swf functions, that Sorenson Squeeze does not offer.
I suggest to serious customers to check out Wildform Flix 2.1. As I mentioned previously, we back up our software with a 15 day money back guarantee.
jb
www.wildform.com
My experience with Flix v1 was that output sizes were nearly double the file size of the input. So I realized that I did not do the 2-Pass VBR so I retried my video using the demo. My results were nearly the same. What I forgot to mention in my last post was that my video lost sync with my audio and when I retried it did it again. My video was skippy and very grainy and lined once again. Still I have no option to create a .flv file. All my stting for the second time around were set to the max possible, max bitrate for audio and video, 100% image quality, etc. The original uncompressed .mov file was 450 mb in size. When I compressed it with Squeeze the Flv file was 9mb. The FLV file is normally a larger file then it resulting swf format usually by more than double. When I compressed it with Flix V2.1 the size as a swf was 7mb. The quality of the end result Squeezed swf is much much cleaner. The end swf size of my entire project with the imported flv is only 7mb. I am sure that the water mark and added audio of the demo is going to effect the video quality a little but this is a bit much. Now I could get the full version and try it out and have the opportunity to get my money back which is very convenient but how could the quality in the demo be so much different than that of the full. If it is the case than why even have the demo. It just made me not like the product. Believe me I want Flix to be the solution to the problems that exists with trying to make video in Flash but when I am using my projects for CD using a projector file... I eant the best quality and that is qute simply still from Sorenson Squeeze.
wow I need to spell check before I submit..
hehe
I've been doing some experiments with video and Flash MX ( testing whether my next CD-ROM project will be done entirely in Flash or Director)... so far I'm not too happy.
My main problem is if you create a projector that contains a 30 minute video, it will load the whole thing into memory before playing. Hence some the of unusually long load times some people might be experiencing.
This is not too bad if you have 500+ mb RAM, but try running the projector on a 32mb PC. Task manager showed the Projector sucking up 120MB memory for a 1.5 minute video.
My next experiment is to create a blank Projector with a simple Loadmovie action (loading an external .swf with the video). I'm hoping that the external file will stream rather than load all at once, though I suspect it won't.
- Leo
JHarlequin, I'm happy for you that you feel so strongly about Squeeze, but I humbly disagree.
I will post some comparisons for you and others to view. When I have them, I'll post the link here.
We will address the demo issues soon.
I suggest people try for themselves. With Flix you get 200% more features at 40% the price.
jb
Scrawl,
You are correct about the way the Flash player handles CD swf's.
We suggest that you not create SWF's larger than 50 MB, but you can make them smaller. Then you need to load them in sequentially. (By the way, our software Flix has an automatic feature allowing you to load a new swf at the end of your current swf.)
With your Mac projectors, you have to make sure to allocate enough memory, or it won't work with people using any OS before OSX.
jb
www.wildform.com
the video will stream as long as it is in the main timeline (not in a MC).Saving video to a separate swf is a very good thing to do.
I do not want to be knocking down at your product, which it obviously seems like it is, but I am not saying what I say because I am in love with Squeeze or even that I have anything against Wildform or Flix. I am simply saying what has happened for me so that others out there who read these forums may relate or contrast or even help me. It just seems to me like there is very little for Flix to stand on when in my own non-biased testing Squeeze comes out with the better quality. Now I am in no way dicouraging others from trying Flix... infact I encourage the to gather your own findings but in my 6 mo using Flix v1 and now seeing v2 the results of my testing are still there. Even the video demos on the wildform site do not compare even though they were obviously made for the web. The statement of 400% more options is a little much when those options don't get you 400% further. Yes Flix is the answer for version for Flash 3-5. There is no question or competition.
I had the same exact problem with video in Flash. I only had a 4 min video and it took about 5-30 seconds to load on computers from a CD. That's no good because the honest truth is that Flash cannot preload video into RAM by streaming like a video might from the web. I had extensive talks with MM techs about this very topic and they said that this is a new thing for them to have to deal with. They are now realizing that more and more people are going to want to put out bigger and bigger videos and at the moment the only thing you can do is wait for it to load while the rest of your movie stands still. It does not work the same as the web where you are downloading the file. It is a problem that MM is going to be working on. I doubt it will be anything solved in a patch rather it may be done for v7. For a 30 min video your only real option (as sad as it seems for Flash users like us) is to use Director for now. Or you can have Flash call on an external player like quicktime for mac or windows media player for pc. You will just now have something else playing your video over your flash movie. That is the cheap less design friendly method.Quote:
Originally posted by edan
the video will stream as long as it is in the main timeline (not in a MC).Saving video to a separate swf is a very good thing to do.
Misquoted the 400% I apologize but my point still works with 200%
Thanks for all the responses. This has been one of the most helpfull message boards I've been on in a while.
I used OS 10 and everything imports fine. Now we are testing to see what the best combination of compression is. Some of our raw files are a gig or more. Maybe we are asking to much of flash, but hey, they said they do video so we are going to push.
My next issue is...
Has anyone had any problems with the playback speed of larger (non-web size) video in the player or projector? For example will the player control the playback speed, or will the video be able to play without being slowed down by the player? I don't even know if that made sense, but any comments would be greatly appreciated.
I've been working with fairly large files (200MB original files, 45MB SWF files) and have not noticed the player slowing down the video. I have, however, noticed that larger video (320x240) seems to drift after a couple of minutes, so that by the end the audio is out of sync with the video by like 1 second. I noticed someone has processed a 15 minute video, did you have any problem with audio drifting?
just for ref. The reason you had trouble before OS X, is the previous versions of th eMac OS had no dynamic memory managment. Thank goodnees They fixed that with OS 10!
I had the same exact problem with the audio drifting and it was only by less than a sec as you said. It is really only bad when it video of people talking. The 45MB swf video Running off of a CD will take a bit to load. I tried 20MB video and I tried it on multiple computers ranging from a Dual 1.4 Machine all the way down to a 450mhz. The load time to get the video into the computers RAM ranged from 5 to 30 sec.Quote:
Originally posted by bwat
I've been working with fairly large files (200MB original files, 45MB SWF files) and have not noticed the player slowing down the video. I have, however, noticed that larger video (320x240) seems to drift after a couple of minutes, so that by the end the audio is out of sync with the video by like 1 second. I noticed someone has processed a 15 minute video, did you have any problem with audio drifting?
Quote:
Originally posted by bwat
I've been working with fairly large files (200MB original files, 45MB SWF files) and have not noticed the player slowing down the video. I have, however, noticed that larger video (320x240) seems to drift after a couple of minutes, so that by the end the audio is out of sync with the video by like 1 second. I noticed someone has processed a 15 minute video, did you have any problem with audio drifting?
I have added a 300mb video at 800x600 to my flash presentation... when i imported it at 100% my projector file ended up like 310mb.. which is huge, i put the import setting to 95% and the projector dropped to 50mb (yeah what a difference) i am not sure if the sound drifted, like 95% of the video is showing a production plant, and talking behind it... havent seen anything major wrong just yet.. good luck...
Am I crazy or did I hear someone at a MM seminar say that you can link to .flv files from flash? I know this is possible with quicktime (it gives the option to link on import), but I could have sworn the .flv format does this too. Also, could someone explain to me why the .flv format is better than importing something created in Media Cleaner and imported into MX as an avi, or mpeg, or mov?
Oh yeah, my groups is currently using Squeeze. So far, we like it. But I did not know about Flix, and I am especially interested in how it can loadMovies (.flv's) one after the next. When I asked Squeeze people about this they said it would be a few months before it could provide this kind of "stitching".
Ok. I give info. No gimme somepin' back.
you can link to your quicktime file but then you can only publish to quicktime not swf or flash exe. I don't think you can link to a flv only import after squeezing it, I think compressing with squeeze as a flv and importing gives you better quality than squeezing a quicktime and importing it, but that's my own opinion.
I don’t usually write in, but I thought I would this time. A few months ago I was hired to by someone to work with the Flash MX beta and Sorenson Squeeze Beta on a huge project. I won’t say who the company was, or what the project was, but I will say that is was very exciting. We were going to be the first to use MX to distribute a 90 min conference over the web, and it was to go on a very popular Flash site (I’m trying to be politically correct here, as to not shoot myself in the foot). It wasn’t to long before we found some huge problems and told both companies about it. The first problem was that if a user was on a PC using IE, any .swf they started to download couldn’t be stopped. This means if a user starts to download an .swf video that’s 5mb in size, and decides to click on a different .swf video that’s 5mb is size; MX doesn’t stop downloading the first file into the cache. The user is now only using the second file, but downloading both. I hope that makes sense. This bug is just starting to come out in the open (even though I told them about it months ago) and it’s crashing people’s computers and drying up their bandwidth. Flashmagazine.com has a nice write up about it. The second huge issue is that of memory usage. Anything more then 4 minutes of video and the memory usages grows expeditiously. That’s when Sorenson told me about “stitching”. Soon they will have (probably in their next upgrade) an option to “stitch” the clip. This means that the video will be chunked into 2 or three minutes clips, and each will create an instance and load the next clip into it. So if you have a 10-minute video it will create 5 clips that will load themselves after each other. At least this is one of the benefits. They were also talking about creating instant loading bars (like QuickTime) and some other very cool sounding features. To say the least we got the project done and told MM about all the bugs we found. None of them were addressed but I’m sure they will be. I was told a month before the release by MM that they didn’t thing that video was going to be a big seller and that no one would want to use more then 2 mins worth anyway. Smart move. I think that MX shows good potential for the future and could take the place of Director someday, just not yet. The project was finished but will never see the light of day because “the powers that be” don’t want to promote more then 2 mins of video because of all the issues. Well…at least I got paid.
Wow harmonixmedia,
great information, thanks!
So from what you've seen, any video SWF's over 2MB are taking the chance of choking the computer, and "stitching" should be used instead? Could this be causing the audio/video sync problems that I've been hitting?
Great stuff, thanks for sharing.
bwat,
I noticed that the synch went out a bit towards the end on a 7 minute flv file I was working with. I am inclined to think that it has to do with the memory allocation problem described.
I will have to create a "stitched" version of the 7 min video thing. What I will have to do is synch the content to each video. In other words, I will create one swf with its respective flv (video) and timed content, then that file will load the next swf with its respective flv (video) and timed content, and so on and so forth. It should keep things in synch, but I hope it looks decent.
Has anyone tried this approach?
I am going to try the "stitched" video approach in the next week and see how it works for me. And when I say "stitched" I mean exporting the long video into multiple separate SWFs and trying to load them sequentially with scripting.
I have noticed that rather than feeding the source video in to the FLA as one big file, if it's broken down into smaller files and brought in and laid out on the timeline sequentially, if it drifts out of sync in one clip, when it hits a new clip in the time line it seems to regain sync for a little while. I haven't tested enough to see if this works consistently or not, but it might be another thing to look into. I'll be playing with this as well.
Cool. That is the approach I am using. Let me know how it works out for you. This meassage board is probably the best one on the web right now for information on doing video in MX. Let's keep it going with our results.
I have a 20 minute movie that I have imported into flash... the audio is out of sync on slower machines, 128mb or less... i have 1 gig of memory at work, and the video/audio is great... how do i stitch, or break the movie up? any help would be greatly appriciated...
thanks
Quote:
Originally posted by nowhereman55
bwat,
I noticed that the synch went out a bit towards the end on a 7 minute flv file I was working with. I am inclined to think that it has to do with the memory allocation problem described.
I will have to create a "stitched" version of the 7 min video thing. What I will have to do is synch the content to each video. In other words, I will create one swf with its respective flv (video) and timed content, then that file will load the next swf with its respective flv (video) and timed content, and so on and so forth. It should keep things in synch, but I hope it looks decent.
Has anyone tried this approach?
Here’s how I’ve stitched clips in the past. Let’s say you have a 10 min video clip. Use QuickTime or another product to chuck the video into 2 min segments. Then create a player interface in Flash. If you want to put rewind buttons, pause buttons, stop and play buttons, or just want a plain viewer make it here. In the player create a blank movieclip the size of your video. For example 320 x 240. This will give you a feel for where you should place it. Give the movieclip an instance name. For example “stage”. Then import your first chunk of video into a new movie. Use the “Spark Lite” in Flash MX or use an .flv file from “Spark Pro” (I highly recommend the latter). Once you’ve imported the video skip to the end of the clip and add a key frame on a new layer. On the frame tell Flash to load the next video clip into the “stage” mc. This will take some planning ahead because you will have to know what you’re going to name the next clip. For example:
loadMovie("video2.swf", "_root.stage");
Then export the .swf. Continue to create all of your video clip .swf files this way. At the end you should have 6 files. One player and 5 video clips. Then add a little code in you payer to load the first video clip .swf and the whole thing should just take off, each loading the next when their done.
Known issues: First of all I know that if you are making this for a CD-ROM there will be short and very jarring pauses between the stitches as the next clip is loaded. I don’t know how to get rid of this. One option is to load the next clip in a separate mc and tell it to play. The only problem with that is that you might have a memory jarring in the process. I digitized 5 minutes and 45 seconds worth of U2 concert footage from their Boston concert DVD recently (what an awesome concert). I used the Sorenson 3 codec in QuickTime and the video used 17mb of memory. The same clip in Flash used 47mb of memory so be warned.
I hope this helps and if anyone else thinks of a better way to do this let me know. I hope that Macromedia has received the message that we want to use video in Flash loud enough that they will make a few changes in the future. I suspect that they don’t want to compete too much with their other products (Director) but they need to go one-way or the other.
new to flash video and was curious...how do you handle the large swf file sizes when using the file on the web?
That’s a good question, and it raises an even more interesting one. Does video on the Internet really work? By day I work as an instructional designer at BYU. Using video has been an issue for us for years. Video has a strict quality to file size ratio. The better the quality of the video, the larger the file size, plain an simple.
If your site caters to large and low bandwidth users then you need to create both options with your video. 320x240 mid quality for large bandwidth and 160x120 low quality for low bandwidth users. Ultimately preloaders are going to be more important now then ever before. You should let one third of you video load before playing it (just an opinion).
My biggest fear is that the people that hate Flash are going to get ammo for their augments as Flashers start using video just because they can, and not because they should. I would hate to see a 3 min video as I enter a site that has a “skip video” button in the lower left.
I've been doing video in Flash for a while now ... am still yet to really push the whole Flash Video format
But surely common sense applies? A 45mb movie is NOT going to stream on many Web based machines, and a HIGH percentage of machines will have a hissy fit trying to play a 45mb flash movie anyway (even if off CD).
Hmm I must admit this is a good topic, and I can see I need to go read some more on this ...
Interesting re stitching comments, thanks for the tips guys.
And re wildform's flix/swfx, I am a huge fan of theirs, both products are excellent and underpriced imho. It's great to see an innovative new company develop some really excellent design tools. (um you guys need to update your video clip library though, eg with color "business life" , conference meetings, other practical video clips)..
As for MM, grr, maybe they'll fix their buggy MX release someday, I'm not going to make the switch from 5 to MX til they fix it, sounds like too many MX problems so far.
HINT: I found that experimenting with various codecs is critical to success in streaming web video, there's usually at least 12 to choose from, when you're encoding your original source uncompressed .avi or whatever.
So, try encoding with 2-3 different codecs, export via flash etc each version, to see which one streams the best, there's usually up to 20% variation in image quality, so worth playing around with.
I had the same problem and this was my solution... I managed to get rid of the loading 'freeze' and you can downlod the FLA sample... hope this helps
http://66.70.72.50/forums/showthread...ight=video+RAM
That was a big problem of mine on a recent project where the video was 4 min long and it took any where from 5-25 seconds to load into ram. I called MM and talked to a bunch of their techs and the were dumb founded trying to tell me to use a regular preloader... This seems like a great method of loading and showing a preloader. Here is the biggest problem that I have come up with. You and I are both running Flash MX on a PC and expecting to make a projector that will run our project from a CD on both the windows and Mac platforms. I did an entire project rleying on that fact. Little did I know that Flash MX projectors WILL NOT PLAY IN A MAC WITH OS 9.1 or Higher!!! It is possible for it to play but not without the client or customer downloading the the "CarbonLib 1.5" Updater from apples website. I called up MM and complained to them and they gave me no answers and no hope for a fix. WTF is wrong with them!!! Flash 5 works with Mac. I have tried so many times to give MM the benefit of the doubt with this version of Flash and it just keeps comming back to bite me in the ass. I was able to license the download from apple to distibute onto CD along with my project but it is stil too much to have to put the client through to have to install something on their computer. I had to buy Director for the Mac and I had to buy a Mac. The only good thing about it is that the new IMac is a beautiful addition to my desk.
"Flash MX projectors WILL NOT PLAY IN A MAC WITH OS 9.1 or Higher!!!"
****, could things get any more F^up!!! I almost went crazy when I found out that the video went into RAM because the project I'm working on (Also an interactive CD-Rom) required video and I already used some of the features in MX to get things going so there was no turning back :(
I also heard that the new projector doesn’t recognise dual monitors, I tried it and the projector fixed its self in the middle one part on each side, I swear flash 5 never did that... But I could be wrong because I haven’t tested it fully
Great post indeed, very helpful :)
it.