Are you RAW?

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06-14-2005, 10:00 AM
admedia

Are you RAW?

Shooting in RAW format means that the raw image data is captured and no in-camera processing is performed allowing you to have total control over settings such as exposure and color temperature that are usually handled in-camera as you are shooting. Instead you are able to make adjustments when you open the image in your camera (or editing) software. It is nice to use when exposure and color temp is questionable in a given situation. It is used at the expense of memory and speed. RAW images are much larger than standard (jpeg) format so it takes more room on your memory card and takes longer to save.

I use RAW if I feel I am going to want to adjust and experiment heavily with an image. Mostly I shoot high quality jpegs. Camera manufacturers recommend you use their software when opening and adjusting a RAW image as the processing is often proprietary and varies from camera to camera. Adobe Photoshop CS will handle RAW images though and I actually use it as well as the Nikon software that came with my camera.

If, when and how do you use RAW?
06-14-2005, 12:22 PM
aversion

There's no point in not shooting RAW files, only if you're really limited on storage space should you shoot JPEGs. RAW files are digital negatives, JPEGs are digital images. A film negative comes out of the camera and is processed in a darkroom, with a JPEG you're taking and developing your image in the camera, with a RAW file you're taking the shot with the camera and developing it with photoshop or some other tool. It allows you far more control over 'pushing' or 'pulling' the image than in camera does, plus an app like photoshop or the one linked below is simply much much better at 'developing' a digital image than your camera is. It's much closer to a darkroom process.

I use this free RAW converter most of the time.
http://www.pixmantec.com/products/ra...ssentials.html
06-14-2005, 04:20 PM
1stbite

I shoot raw all the time, only drop to medium jpg's if i'm out grabbing some low quality textures for 3d stuff.
06-14-2005, 05:16 PM
admedia

Actually my camera has a RAW / Basic mode which is nice... gives me a medium jpeg for a quick preview or email etc... and RAW to work with for finer work.

Time to get 1-2 GB card and use it more.
06-14-2005, 06:13 PM
asheep_uk

I'd like too, but so far I only have a point-and-click digital camera. I've never really got into digital photography, as far as really changing things - I still go back to film techniques. I'd like to know how to be more confident doing it.

Any books or sites for recommendations?
06-14-2005, 06:29 PM
PAlexC

Storage is so cheap, there's no reason not to shoot RAW.

Here's Adobe's Digital Negative intiative page:
http://www.adobe.com/products/dng/main.html
06-14-2005, 06:35 PM
admedia

I wouldn't say always shoot RAW.

1. I think it sacrafices speed as well as storage... sometimes I like to do some high speed stuff at 3 FPS with my camera... which I don't think is possible shooting RAW.

2. Not every shoot warrants RAW format. Sometimes I am just grabbing a quick subject for a webpage or some snapshots to email. Sometimes shooting RAW is overkill.
06-14-2005, 08:50 PM
aversion

Quote:

Originally Posted by PAlexC

Here's Adobe's Digital Negative intiative page:
http://www.adobe.com/products/dng/main.html

It's nice but it'll never work because the manufacturers want to keep their edge on their RAW files, Nikon's new RAW format doesn't have an open white balance code for example, so you'd need to use Nikon licenced software to adjust the white balance on your image. It may not seem like much but the 'abilities' of a RAW file are important to digital pros, I can't see manufacturers using an open format like adobe's.
06-15-2005, 01:11 AM
MiLo_Anderson

What kind of camera do you have Almedia?
06-15-2005, 01:20 AM
Frets

Speed matters to me. Having an older digital camera even though it does have raw capabilites It takes longer to store as raw then it should (in my opinion)
As for internal color balance as a personal preference I turn it off a simple gamma
correction is all I've ever found the needed to correct color inconsitencies.
06-15-2005, 01:33 AM
aversion

The 20d does a good job with RAW, you can shoot a burst of 6 frames in just over a second, then the buffer has to clear, which takes about 10 seconds, then you can go again. JPEG is certainly faster, it's still 5fps but you can shoot up to 25 or more frames at that rate before the buffer needs to clear.
06-15-2005, 05:25 AM
ctranter

Depends on the speed of the card you are writing to also.

I always shoot raw, at the moment I just use Photoshop to open them.
06-15-2005, 09:39 AM
admedia

Quote:

Originally Posted by MiLo_Anderson

What kind of camera do you have Almedia?

Nikon D70.

The bottom line is from this thread I learned I sould buy a bigger card and use the RAW / Jpeg mode more often.

____________________________
06-15-2005, 10:17 AM
robbmcaulay

Quote:

Originally Posted by aversion

I can't see manufacturers using an open format like adobe's.

This is just for converting all kinds of RAW format into a single format that Adobe will always support, it's for longevity...
06-15-2005, 10:22 AM
aversion

Right, but the more manufacturers close out the RAW formats the less adobe will be able to read them, including in PS. Again Nikon keeping white balance data proprietary means only Nikon licenced software can adjust the white balance on their RAW files.

Quote:

The bottom line is from this thread I learned I sould buy a bigger card and use the RAW / Jpeg mode more often.

RAW and JPEG together is bigger and slower than just RAW, unless you really need a JPEG along with your RAW I would recommend just shooting RAW. I use irfanview for all my image viewing in windows and it can read RAW files and add them to the windows shell, so that when you view a folder in explorer the thumbnails show.

Quote:

Depends on the speed of the card you are writing to also.

True, the 10 seconds it takes to flush the buffer on my camera is how long it takes on the lexar 1 gig cards I use.
06-16-2005, 09:39 PM
WannaBe_80z

i have a kodak crap 2.1 mp camera...this thread makes me wanna cry...

I want a Canon 20D or Nikon D70...;(

Hell, even a Canon 10D would make me smile...anyone wanna give out charities. ;)
06-17-2005, 11:07 AM
admedia

Probably not what you want...
but there are alot of camera models (not DSLR)
that save in RAW.
06-17-2005, 12:07 PM
icculus22

I always shoot RAW. Like it has been said a high speed card solves the bigger file sie issue. My Minolta has a 128 meg buffer so I can shoot around 10-12 photos continously without any loading.

CS and CS2's RAW convertors are great tools. The ability to push or pull 4 stops either way is great.

For me this is closest way of simulating processing the film yourself with digital photography.
06-17-2005, 02:48 PM
WannaBe_80z

Quote:

Originally Posted by admedia

Probably not what you want...
but there are alot of camera models (not DSLR)
that save in RAW.

Oh no, exactly what I want. I have been drooling over DLSR's ever since I got my hands on a Rebel 300D last year in class.
06-17-2005, 05:46 PM
admedia

Quote:

Originally Posted by WannaBe_80z

Oh no, exactly what I want. I have been drooling over DLSR's ever since I got my hands on a Rebel 300D last year in class.

That's what I meant. You probably aren't interested in a non-DSLR, but they are sometimes half the price, but still will save in RAW format.
06-17-2005, 09:46 PM
WannaBe_80z

oh, sorry misread.

yea, I have no interest in point and shoot anymore.
06-18-2005, 01:32 PM
robbmcaulay

Am I Raw? I am now... tried it this morning, amazing!

http://www.robbmc.com/misc/fk/raw.jpg
08-26-2006, 07:14 AM
littleMatt

Sorry to be a complete n00b... but how do you import RAW files into photoshop?

I'm trying for the first time at PS tells me that it can't open this file because it's not the right kind of document. What's up with that?

I'm using PS CS and a D70s.
08-26-2006, 10:02 AM
asheep_uk

I get the same error message using my D50, no idea what happens.

For that reason - and the fact I don't own new version of Photoshop - I only shoot half of my photos raw, and I use iPhoto to convert to them to JPG for editing.
08-26-2006, 10:13 AM
littleMatt

Do you get the same benefits using iPhoto?

I imported the RAW file into Lightroom but I could see any way of editing it more than normal.
08-26-2006, 10:19 AM
Ask The Geezer

Glad this old thread came up. I just got CS2 and it will open RAW's from my D30.

But, I can't figure out how to change [whatever it is I need to change] in it, to use one RAW to produce 3 or even 7 jpg's for HDR in Photomatix.

Any pointers?
08-26-2006, 12:17 PM
Ask The Geezer

Littlematt, maybe this will help. I also answered my own question above.

Here's some screenshots of the RAW filetypes you can open. And I just use the File/Open menu to get there. You probably already knew that.

http://board.flashkit.com/board/imag.../2006/08/1.jpg

Once the RAW is open, you see this screen in CS, and just use the "Exposure" slider to change the exposure to whatever you want. When you save out a series of jpg's, you can import them to Photomatix for HDR. and I can see, I will prolly be shooting many more RAW's now with my camera. :D

http://board.flashkit.com/board/imag.../2006/08/1.jpg
08-26-2006, 12:19 PM
aversion

Go to adobe.com there should be a RAW update you can download for free that will allow you to open newer RAW files.
08-26-2006, 12:26 PM
Ask The Geezer

Maybe that's why mine shows a lot of RAW formats. As soon as I installed CS, it went to do an auto update?
08-26-2006, 01:00 PM
asheep_uk

Quote:

Originally Posted by aversion

Go to adobe.com there should be a RAW update you can download for free that will allow you to open newer RAW files.

Thanks Miles - I never even thought of that!

Any Photoshop CS2 users looking for the update: http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop/cameraraw.html, a little way down, Camera Raw 3.4

CS or previous users: for Mac http://www.adobe.com/support/downloa...form=Macintosh and for Windows http://www.adobe.com/support/downloa...atform=Windows

However, much to my annoyance, if you have a Nikon D50, you have to use Photoshop CS2, not CS.

:(
08-26-2006, 01:08 PM
littleMatt

the only new files extensions I can find on adobe.com that support the D70s are for CS2 - and the new file for CS supports the D70... not the "s"...

http://www.fishandonions.com/randomFK/RAWprolems.jpg

How annoying!
08-26-2006, 01:16 PM
asheep_uk

Apparently you can use the Adobe "DNG 3.2 converter to convert your raw files to DNG files" and then use them in CS I presume?

http://www.adobe.com/products/dng/

Playing with it now...
08-26-2006, 01:24 PM
littleMatt

That did it! :D

Cheers guys

edit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ask The Geezer

Once the RAW is open, you see this screen in CS, and just use the "Exposure" slider to change the exposure to whatever you want. When you save out a series of jpg's, you can import them to Photomatix for HDR. and I can see, I will prolly be shooting many more RAW's now with my camera. :D

http://board.flashkit.com/board/imag.../2006/08/1.jpg

Why the hell didn't I start using this ages ago!
08-26-2006, 01:35 PM
asheep_uk

What version of the Camera Raw plug-in and Adobe DNG Converter are you using?

I'm using Camera Raw 2.0 and DNG Converter 3.4. The Converter works with D50 files, but Photoshop CS then says "Could not complete...not the right kind of document" when I open a DNG file.

:(
08-26-2006, 01:41 PM
Ask The Geezer

Quote:

Once the RAW is open, you see this screen in CS

Well, maybe I misspoke, I actually have CS-2. I thought they were all the same.
08-26-2006, 01:47 PM
littleMatt

Quote:

Originally Posted by asheep_uk

What version of the Camera Raw plug-in and Adobe DNG Converter are you using?

I'm using Camera Raw 2.0 and DNG Converter 3.4. The Converter works with D50 files, but Photoshop CS then says "Could not complete...not the right kind of document" when I open a DNG file.

:(

I'm using the Camera Raw you linked to, and DNG 3.4... I convert and when I drag the file into PS I get the same screen that Ask The Geeza showed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ask The Geezer

Well, maybe I misspoke, I actually have CS-2. I thought they were all the same.

Yeah it looks the same in CS.
08-26-2006, 02:25 PM
asheep_uk

Quote:

Originally Posted by littleMatt

I'm using the Camera Raw you linked to, and DNG 3.4... I convert and when I drag the file into PS I get the same screen that Ask The Geeza showed.

Boy do I feel stupid. First I forget you can update software, then I don't even follow my own link.

All working - thanks guys :)

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