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Hi,
I enjoyed the how much to charge sticky. One question I have is do you ask for any money upfront? Like a good faith deposit? I ask because I get my clients off of Craigslist and some can be shady. Also, that leads me to ask, where are you getting your clients from?
Thanks.
depending on the size of the project, it is customary to ask for 50% upfront at the time of them 'hiring' you and 50% at the end.
I always work with contracts no matter what. Even if you're doing most of your work online rather than face to face, this is still good practice (especially if you think your clients could be shady). Shoot them a PDf of the contract and ask them to print, sign and fax back the final page or have them scan it and email it back.
As far as getting clients. mine have all been word of mouth, i have yet to go through craigslist or similar.
There is a freelance forum here that you might want to frequent. New projects are posted often.
This is straight from one of my contracts specifying payment:
Quote:
12. Initial Payment and Refund Policy.
The total amount of this contract is $xxxx
This agreement begins with an initial payment of $xxxx (50%). If the client halts work and applies by registered letter for a refund within 30 days, to the Director of _________________, work completed shall be billed at the hourly rate stated above, and deducted from the initial payment, the balance of which shall be returned to the client. If, at the time of the request for refund, work has been completed beyond the amount covered by the initial payment, the client shall be liable to pay for all work completed. No portion of this initial payment will be refunded unless written application is made within 30 days of signing this contract.
Thank you so much for that!
I don't always work with 50% upfront, sometimes I break the project down into billable milestones, which may look like this :
Sign off and agreement of concept - 10% billable
Handover of alpha version - 30% billable
Handover of release candidate - 40% billable
Handover of v 1.0 - 20% billable
Chris Error
I never write up contracts, nor do i ask for any money upfront.
All of my freelance is from word of mouth and is usually from other agencies...so i've never gotten burned.
But if you're a n00b or you're getting clients from craigslist, write up a contract.
I am a lot more liberal than I should be, but it depends on the situation. I rarely ask for money up front and I don't have a formal contract, but on the other hand, (in most cases) I will not release any source files until payment is received.
I have been burned on occasion, but I have had more honest people than snakes.
You also have to remember clients get burned to. Many of my projects have been "I had this guy who bailed on me... can you fix/finish...". Now this begs questions about both parties as to why the relationship fell apart, but both sides are taking a risk. Even a contract is not a guarantee of payment (chances are the legal fees to get the money may be more than what is owed). So both sides are taking a risk and that is just something you have to accept.
I started out in the freelance forums here and kirupa. Initially I would bid on projects, but now people will contact me and I think this actually has more to do with just helping people out in the general forums here. People can see that you at least know something if you are able to help other people with their problems.
Now I should qualify all that I have said with; Freelancing is not my day job. I do it for fun and extra money. So most of my clients are other design firms looking to outsource some of their overflow work.
If you are doing something with an established company or this is your primary source of income, then I would recommend contracts.
Does anybody have a generic/template contract I can use?
that's why i work with contracts and my clients are actually happy to sign them. It protects both parties....the way i have it written is beneficial to everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by kortex
And to creative's point, i don't use contracts all the time. If i'm outsourced, then there is no need as I know where the money will be coming from. But for larger independent projects (things over $500) i need to be secure in knowing i have a document proving that there are terms bonding the project parties.
Good point. I am definitely not against them. I am just lazy with my freelance work.Quote:
that's why i work with contracts and my clients are actually happy to sign them
Have not actually looked at them, but take a look at:Quote:
Originally Posted by doognam
http://www.sessions.edu/career_cente...ates/index.asp
I would recommend EVERYONE get use a contract at ALL times..
they dont need to be scary... or long.. something outlines the general purpose of your project/relationship and the vague listing of requirements that once completed mean the job is done.
I have several 'templates' I created/use..
1.) is my service contract agreement...
part A: outlines my general rules of doing business. source files, payment procedures, payment clearing... everything I can think of that has occurred in a project before.. (retaining rights for portfolio, touching on NDA's if needed)..etc
1099's, using paypal as payment preference...etc..etc
part B: outlines/summarizes the communication sI have had with the clients and briefly notes/displays my re-iteration of the specs/requirements for the project. if to covered on the 'to-do' list..wont be done..
I make note to tell them to READ this carefully, and while things (rules) are NOT set in stone.. if NOT discussed before hand are the way things will go down, no exceptions..
it gives a loose quote on time/cost and asks for them to sign.
once I get this.. I usually start full force on a project.
I then have my 'billing invoice' I use once the project is complete.. that outlines what the project entailed
the clients info, and invoice data
the initial cost/fee
any 1099 fees
any paypal fees
and a sub-total
I usually do NOT release anything crippled demos to a client unless payment has cleared.. if I have worked with a repeat client before..this may not be as much of a concern for me.
:)
maybe we can put together a generic list/template/spreadsheet for the community or something?
I have some nice looking ones I created..
I suppose they could be altered to suit each ones personal needs??
Or at least useful clauses? I added the following to our contracts
Quote:
Design Change requests
The design fee includes two (2) rounds of changes. Change-request must be made in writing. Thereafter any work will be charged at the normal hourly rate ($ ph). Should the number of Change-requests exceed five (5) rounds, the hourly fee will increase by ____% per round.
Amen to that one!Quote:
Originally Posted by Napalm
I always put in change request clauses...
usually slide in with a tounge in cheek comment about taking the time to review and storyboard your project not only saves US time..but YOU money..LOL
my biggest pet peeve is a client who cares less about their own project than i do... doesnt bother to review..or put together a spec/requirement list..etc..etc
LOL
I'll edit out my personal info..and post some of the stuff I use.. Im sure as a community adding/subtracting from our templates we'll come up with a pretty comprehensive, iron-clad contract to use.
;) Like someone named... Jamin?Quote:
Originally Posted by whispers
ESPECIALLY HIM!!!.. hes the cult leader!!
Im adding that name to the 'spam filter' for the forum..... ;)
FK that guy.
lol.. I put his name in your blog.. and your buddies/roommates were like.. Whos Jamin? LOL
Hahaha, I noticed. I had to explain the situation. My roommate knows about the project, just didn't know his name.
Sorry for the hi-jack, nayriffic!
To help you out, don't use Craigslist. End of story. You will get shady people, and that's about it.
At least use the FK Freelance forums. But watch out for people there as well. Just be careful in dealing with people and make sure to cover your ass as much as you possibly can. You will get screwed a few times before you learn. It's almost guaranteed!
And as far as a down payment, for us personally, that varies per client. If it's a large client, more than likely, I take a nice gesture and NOT require a down payment. Especially because a large client isn't going to mess around. They have too much at stake to lose if people found out something like that. A good contract also sometimes can eliminate the need of a down payment. I usually ask for a down payment on new clients and companies that I can tell are rather small or come off as slightly unprofessional. Sometimes I also get clients where I get a gut feeling that they are going to be a problem.
So it really just comes down to whatever makes you comfortable. Comfort is a major factor in a job as a freelancer. If a client is coming off as pushy or just seems a bit shady, you can simply say "no", or to avoid being direct about it, make up some lie about being slammed with current work, or throw out an unreasonable estimate or unreasonable terms. Something extravagant.
I always take a deposit with big clients (say 25- instead of 50%), for the simple reason that the majority of big clients has a 30-90 day payment policy, which can really mess up you cashflow.
Yeah, NET30 is quite common in the industry. But if you consistently have work, NET30 isn't so bad. I sometimes pay subcontrators NET30 because I don't always have the cash to pay them until the project is finished, and that gives some room to play.