Will work for... FREE?

[tpnovak]

Originally posted by TheOriginalFlashDavo
The difference is he is a CPA. If we did have accreditation within the design industry we wouldn't be having this discussion - all accredited designers would be following the same ethical guidelines.

Dave, I think you are over rationalizing the perceived value vs. the reality of accreditations and/or organizations here. Doctors, Lawyers and CPAs all conduct their business under a single set of ethical guidelines. Interestingly, they all are engaged in the practice of providing their services for free (or even "trading out" services) in some form or another. Some for charity (pro bono) some for other businesses. Yet, this doesn't devalue the quality of their work in any way.

It's an issue that is serious enough that the design associations are concerned, so hence any designer should be (my opinion).

Step out of the box for a moment and ask yourself "Why would the design associations be concerned with free work?". Have you considered the fact that they also have operating revenues to achieve? If their members don't see a value for the membership fee paid, the association will fail to secure sustaining revenue and will eventually fold. Obviously, associations are going to be following the practices in the best interest of their paying clients - the members.

This is not to say that associations don't have a value, because I believe it is all relative. However, as I read through this post again you seem to be taking the association's guidelines and teachings as gospel rather than at face value.

[TheOriginalFlashDavo]

Tony, actually, while realising that every person (or organisation) has a vested interest to some extent, I am supportive of this standing for a number of reasons. One happens to be because of the various associations/bodies, another is to do with my personal viewpoint and understanding of what it can do to my business (as my various other posts have shown), and now of course I've been shown more info on the actual legalities, so for myself it simply reinforces my beliefs.

Sure, the associations want subscription fees and so forth, but at the same time they aren't going to get far as representatives if they aren't pursuing an ideology backed by the majority of their members - ie. working designers like myself and others here.

I'm never one to take a belief simply because some person/body/book tells me too. It simply provides me with more information regarding a situation, and armed with as much knowledge as possible I will then make a conscientious decision, as I have done here. This is also why I have urged people to talk to others about, not just take anyone's viewpont here as gospel. Taking ANYTHING you read on the web as gospel is a dangerous thing to practice.

I am very adept at stepping "outside the box" - my travels overseas, living in different cultures, observing a variety of people and environments, variety of jobs and industries worked in, has equipped me well in that area - which is why I can quite clearly see and understand the reasons why people provide freebies (see my previous posts for that), but the fact is that apart from those with vested interests (eg. such as those who run "auction" sites) there are other alternatives that provide EXACTLY THE SAME benefit to a new or budding designer.

Quite simply, I can see no reason whatsoever that you need to do free work to gain something that could not be gained some other, often more effective way. That's the reason why I'm struggling to accept that side of the argument.

Cheers
Dave


[Edited by TheOriginalFlashDavo on 06-20-2002 at 09:12 PM]

[OddDog]

I have not read all the thread (opps), but surely the key to this are the clients, paying or not.

I have a great client who actually asked if I was going to make enough money in a job for him, because he said and i quote `its bad for me if you do not make enough money´. Yes I know, that is shocking to hear from a client. But it is correct.

I have another who fights ever single bill. Whether for 120 euros or more. Bad busioness for him because the work I am giving him is deficient. In comparsion we have gone the extra yard for the prime client.

I forget who but on this board there is someone who is always quoting if you pay nuts you get monkeys. Lots of anger gets projected onto the very young, budding professional (I wonder how many get to make it), but none on the business that accepts these offers of free work.

Again I get the impression that the free work gets offered by an over keen type when in the negociations the business states that more work is in the pipeline, so better do a job cheap first round. With a lack of negociating experience our keen budding pro dives in and offers to do the job for free. A mistake on his part. And on the part of the client for accepting.

A final thought for this rambaling post, can anyone give examples of good quality work done for free in the hope of future work ?


ciao

[damianm]

Originally posted by serpent star
of strengthening their resume. In fact, all of the trades have unions to protect against this sort of thing. Maybe if we had some sort of designers union that I could join and use as a sort of proof of quality and standards over my freebee giving comrades, that would be nice.

Serpent, I think you touched on a new and important issue. The lack of a union for Graphic artist, web designers and other artist. The closest think we do have is the Graphic artist guild (www.gag.org) I'm not currently a member, but have used their hand book before and found it very useful.