Oil Fire

[XU1]

And to juxtaman....If you watched and listened to the CNN report...the commentator CLEARLY said that many people mistook the smoke as coming from the top of a building...hence the shot to show that from that angle it could clearly be mistaken as a building on fire.....you need to listen as well as watch the news mate.

Tony

[juxtaman]

Sure people mistook it...

When i saw it.. and that was live, they were saying how errie it looks over the skyline. The caption under said "blast could be felt miles away"

It was just stupid to even venture into showing that perspective. Becuase people would of seen that from the ground and gone right to cnn where they would see an oil fire.. not the skyline smoke they were worried about.

[XU1]

Originally posted by juxtaman
Sure people mistook it...

When i saw it.. and that was live, they were saying how errie it looks over the skyline. The caption under said "blast could be felt miles away"

It was just stupid to even venture into showing that perspective. Becuase people would of seen that from the ground and gone right to cnn where they would see an oil fire.. not the skyline smoke they were worried about.

Yeah but the point is that some people were confused with the nature of the fire...its pretty simple to me....The shots may have added to the drama, but that only shows how paranoid the Americans are at the moment...and you cant blame them.

Tony

[juxtaman]

just thought it was in poor taste for cnn.

[gerbick]

why should you even care? CNN is just one news source, and not even the best source.

[DJ-Anakin]

ok, all you people that dont agree with the pending 'war' be you american, or european or wherever, you guys have to understand that if we dont stop these people, in this case, iraq, then who will. no one else has the money, resources, or people to do the job right. if we dont get saddam out of power, and that is the ultimate goal, then he will continue to support terrorists, continue to try to build a nuclear bomb, and continue to try to build long range delivery systems. what will happen when he does all this?

what happened in desert storm? saddam got greedy. he wanted the oil. if we (the UN) hadnt stepped in, he would have gone for saudi arabia, where most of the worlds exports on oil come from. then he probably would have tried to go for the next state, then the next, and so on.

see, i have a unique perspective, my step family (step mom, brothers sisters..) and my girlfriend are all from norway. one of the most neutral countries on the planet. they help everyone. and through talking to them, my points have changed. i dont want war. i dont want people to die, but i also dont want a nuclear bomb parked in my backyard.

the other thing is, everyone accuses bush of being the one to do all the 'evil' in the world. bush has a 65% approval rating right now. that means 65% of this country approves of what he is doing overall. basiclly, weather or not they like him. those numbers are very high. not since 9/11 have they been higher (and i believe the 9/11 numbers were of the highest ever).

the US isnt going to do anything without the permission of the UN. you know why? because we need the rest of the world, just liek the rest of the world needs us. look at the numbers of the different stock exchanges. when the US goes up, the world goes up.. when the US goes down, the world go down. For example, look at the numbers of 9/11. wall street came to a standstill, so the rest of the worlds number dropped.

the US doesnt want to kill the iraqi civilians. but the moment that that civilian picks up a gun, they are no longer a civilian, they are a combatant. theyre gonna shoot, so were gonna defend our selves. thats what this whole thing comes down to: if we dont stop them now, they will strike us again, only maybe next time it will be bigger, maybe next time it will be in england, or maybe france, or any othe country. then the views of the world will change, then the world will be askin for help to find the people who did this. and we will help them. because evil is evil. it doesnt matter if the evil was carried out against some other country you dont care about, it fact is that it was against innocent civilians, and that next time it may be you, or your loved ones. mqaybe your children, or your parents and friends. i for one dont want that. and i will stand up and fight against that.

in fact i already have. i did my four years in the US Air Force. i loaded bombs onto b-52's, and worked on their delivery systems. so i have every right to say all of this, and to get upset at all the anti-american slander going around. i did my time.

-frank

[indivision]

i'm with you DJ. and I appreciate your service. these days, my greatest personal fear is that I haven't done enough to help.

[gdstudios]

Originally posted by DJ-Anakin
in fact i already have. i did my four years in the US Air Force. i loaded bombs onto b-52's, and worked on their delivery systems. so i have every right to say all of this, and to get upset at all the anti-american slander going around. i did my time.

*tear*

VERY good post and I support your view 100%. Be prepared to get some feedback tho.

[CVO Chris]

i loaded bombs onto b-52's, and worked on their delivery systems. so i have every right to say all of this

I don't think you need to do service in having a right to say something but maybe I'm wrong

Well I'm all for a war on Iraq. The chip on my shoulder is that they chose Iraq when there are far more dangerous and immediate threats from other countries. Iraq, as it stands now, is no where near as dangerous as some other countries in the *axis of evil*. Why go for Iraq? The obvious perk would be the oil but noneone here can really prove the motive behind a military invasion of Iraq. Unfortunately, such matters are discussed with a select few behind closed doors.

Personally I think Tony Blair should concentrate on Robert Mugabe's regime in Zimbabwe since it involves Britain alot more than Iraq.

Nevertheless, a liberated(?) Iraq can only be a good thing but the current methods on how it should be carried out leave alot to be desired. Is an 8 day bombing campaign (i think) and an all out invasion really the best strategy?

[zvillin]

DJ-Anakin, great post.

Reading all of this has put a damper on an otherwise pretty good day of mine. I to am very aggravated with what I have read. But I am not going to sit hear and tell you what you should and should not think, everyone has an opinion.

I have a lot of family and friends serving for their country and their countrys beliefs. Do I want them to go and die in them middle east, Hell no. But some one has to stop what is going on.

What was stated with France and Germany. I know for a fact that France just isn't in it for World Peace, they have Oil and other investments in the area, war would really screw up those investments.

Finally I just want to ask everyone who has said things about the American way of life. Do you judge a population by what you see on T.V.? I dont judge Europeans that way, please dont judge me that way.

I could rant for hours, but Im not sure people would understand where Im coming from.

Im just simple country folk, and thats part of my opinion

[Hellsbellboy]

yeah yeah I know most of u can't read worth a damn and hate cut and paste jobs.. but i think this artcle sums things up pretty good.


Story from England's Daily Mirror News

No matter what your views on President Bush's statement of upcoming war, this, from an English journalist, is very interesting. Just a word of background, for those of you who aren't familiar with the UK's Daily Mirror. This is a notoriously left-wing daily that is normally not supportive of the colonials across the Atlantic.
**************************************************
***********************
***Tony Parsons Daily Mirror Sept. 11, 2002

One year ago, the world witnessed a unique kind of broadcasting--the mass murder of thousands, live on television. As a lesson in the pitiless cruelty of the human race, September 11 was up there with Pol Pot's Mountain of Skulls in Cambodia, or the skeletal bodies stacked like garbage in the Nazi concentration camps.

An unspeakable act so cruel, so calculate and so utterly merciless that surely the world could agree on one thing....nobody deserves this fate. Surely there could be consensus: The victims were truly innocent, the perpetrators truly evil.

But to the world's eternal shame, 9/11 is increasingly seen as America's comeuppance. Incredibly, anti-Americanism has increased over the last year. There has always been a simmering resentment to the USA in this country; too loud, too rich, too full of themselves, and so much happier than Europeans...but it has become an epidemic. And it seems incredible to me. More that, it turns my stomach.

America is this country's greatest friend and our staunchest ally. We are bound to the US by culture, language and blood. A little over half a century ago, around a half a million Americans died for our freedoms, as well as their own. Have we forgotten so soon? And exactly a year ago, thousands of ordinary men, womwn and children..not just Americans, but from dozens of countries, were butchered by a small group of fanatics. Are we so quick to betray them?

What touched the heart about those who died in the Twin Towers and on the planes, was that we recognized them. Young fathers and mothers, somebody's daughter, husband, wives, and children, some unborn.

And these people brought it on themselves? Their nation is to blame for their meticulously planned slaughter?

These days you don't have to be some dust-encrusted nut job in Kabul or Karachi or Finsbury Park to see America as the Great Satan. The ant-American alliance is made up of self-loathing liberals who blame the Americans for every ill in the Third World, and consevatives suffering from power-envy, bitter that the world's only superpower can do what it likes without having to ask permission.

The truth is that America has behaved with enormous restraint since September 11.

Remember, remember-

Remember the gut wrenching tapes of weeping men phoning their wives to say, "I love you," beforw they were burned alive.

Remember those people leaping to their deaths from the top of the burning skyscrapers.

Remember the hundreds of firemen buried alive.

Remember the smiling face of that beautiful little girl who was on one of the planes with her mum.

Remember, remember-

And realize that America has never retaliated for 9/11 in anything like the way it could have.

So few al-Qaeda tourists got locked without a trial in Camp X-ray? Pass the Kleenex...

So some afhan wedding receptions were shot up after they merrily fired their semi-automatics in a sky full of American planes? A shame, but maybe next time they should stick to confetti.

America could have turned a large chunk of the world into a parking lot. That it didn't is a sign of strength. American voices are already being raised against attacking Iraq...that's what democracy is for. How many in the Islamic world will have a minute's silence for the slaughtered innocents of 9/11? How many Islamic leaders will have the gurs to say that a mass murder of 9/11 was an abomination?

When the news of 9/11 broke on the west Bank, those freedom-loving Palestinians were dancing in the street. America watched all of that and didn't push the button. We should thank the stars that America is the most poerful nation in the world. I still find it incredible that 9/11 did not provoke all-out war. Not a "war on terrorism." A real war

The fundamentalist dudes are talking about "opening the gates of HELL, if America attacks Iraq. Well, America could have opened the gates of HELL like you wouldn't believe.

The US is the most militarily powerful nation that ever strode the face of the earth. The campaign in Afghanistan may have been less than perfect and the planned war on Iraq may be misconceived.

But don't blame America for not bringing peace and light to these wretched countries. How many democracies are there in the Middle East, or in the Muslim world? You can count them on the fingers of one hand assuming you haven't had any chopped off for minor shoplifting.

I love America, yet America is hated. I guess that makes me Bush's poodle. But I would rather be a dog in New York City than a Prince in Riyadh. Above all, America is hated because it is what every country wants to be...rich, free, strong, open, optimistic. Not ground down by the past, or religion, or some caste system. America is the best friend this country ever had and we should start remembering that.

Or do you really think the USA is the root of all evil? Tell it to the loved ones of the men and women who leaped to their death from the burning towers.

Tell it to the nursing mothers whose husband died on one of the hijacked planes, or were ripped apart in a collapsing skyscraper. And tell it to the hundreds of young widows whose husband worked for the New York Fire Department.

To our shame, George Bush gets worse press than Saddam Hussein. Once we were told that Saddam gassed the Kurds, tortured his own people and set up rape-camps in Kuwait. Now we are told he likes Quality Street. Save me the orange center, Oh Mighty One!

Remember, remember, September 11-

No, do more than remember. Never forget.

[indivision]

awesome article. thanks.

[gdstudios]

Yeah, I had read this last week through email circulation. It really is impressive, considering the source.

[DJ-Anakin]

wow.. very good article. and every bit is true.

CVO Chris:
i didnt mean that because you havnt been in the military, you dont have the right to speak. everyone in this country has the right to speak. i was just stating this for the future, in case someone asked 'what right do *I* have to say all this?'.

-frank

[gdstudios]

You know, I've realized something. All of the corruption in politics around the world (especially in America) has led many good citizens to think that their voices don't mean anything. In general, and understandably, people don't like the idea of lacking meaning and importance. It really stinks that people on FK feel the need to constantly tell others that they respect their opinions. It should be understood. Damn corrupt politicans. They've ruined everything!

[CVO Chris]

Just seeking clarification Anakin. I'm quite picky at times

Originally posted by gdstudios
It really stinks that people on FK feel the need to constantly tell others that they respect their opinions. It should be understood.

From what I gather most people do respect others opinions in here. Granted some people get a bit hot-headed in some debates but so far I havn't seen anyone brush someone off just for the sake of not thinking what they say has no value.

Where are the people constantly telling others to respect their opinions?

[indivision]

I don't really think it's a bad thing that people let people know that they respect others opinions. It's just a person showing that they value the company of the other members, even if they disagree with them... on this point, i think it's worse for the community when members in conflict can't make an apology or a gesture of understanding toward those they are debating.

[DJ-Anakin]

Originally posted by indivision
i think it's worse for the community when members in conflict can't make an apology or a gesture of understanding toward those they are debating.

here, here!