How much should I charge for <blank>?

[ReNo.exe]

[PCRIDE]

PEOPLE ARE CHEAP, PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO PAY ALOT OF MONEY, (SINGLE DO IT YOURSELFERS)


BIG TIME BIZ YA THEY GO THE MONEY AND THEY WANT EVERYPENNYWORTH.

THE END

[metagrapher]

Cartoonsmart: One thing- six months down the road, noone remembers how much the deisgner was paid. Noone knows the circumstances behind the somewhat crappy design. Noone knows that you had to throw it together in 16 hours, for $300. All they know is that you did shotty work.
The whole tailor the project thing kinda works, but if you don't know how much it is costing you to run your freelance business per hour, and you don't estimate your projects based on time, then you are going to get taken every time.

Important note: ALWAYS ALLOW MORE TIME THAN YOU EXPECT.

beginner's mistake #1: underestimating time required.

beginner's mistake #2: going for perfect. perfect is when the client is satisfied. I can gaurantee that the client is satisfied long before you are. it's finding that middle ground that makes you happy and your client pee themself.

[yanuart]

I just wanna know how much an hourly rate for flash developer especially flash game developer?

Alot of people sent me emails and I think they're just probing to see wether they can land a good deal or not. Usually they just asked "How much does it take?" and when I replied by asking "What is the scope of the project, what do you want to make, it really depends on those factors".. well, probably only 10% of them replied back cause I bet lots of them don't know what they want to make, they just like "give me your hourly rate and if its good enough for me, I come up with a project that match my budget"

I think hourly rate is a good ground both for you and your future clients.

[metagrapher]

if
[net pay] = ([how much you need to live] + [how much extra you deserve])
then
[gross pay] = [net pay] + ([net pay] * [tax percentage])
and if
[business net pay] = [gross pay] + [business expenses]
then
[business gross pay] = [business net pay] + ([business net pay] * [business tax percentage])

[hourly rate] = ([business monthly gross pay] / [4 weeks]) / [hours in work week]

Note: This plan assumes you are starting with monthly earnings. This plan accounts for the "double taxation" of a C Class Corporation in the US. Individual taxes in the US are approx 22% while corporate taxes vary from 15% to 35% depending on Corporation's Adjusted Gross Income. Sole Proprietorships utilize a model in which corporate earnings are passed directly to the proprietor. In this case the business instance of net to gross conversion can be eliminated (leaving business gross to equal business net), but a taxation of more than 40% must be accounted for on the individual level.

Basically: take how much you need to make (or how much you think you are worth) and devide by the hours you intend to work. This will give you your hourly rate.

[PCRIDE]

30.00- 40 hour, freelance, thats it, if your not making atleast 150-200 a day, then its not worth it, i get the job done quick then charge more, if it takes you along time like 80 hours then charging 35-40 hr may be too much, if you do this as a hobby (job) then get atleast a bit more than what you make at your current job,

so lets say you make at your normal labor , non benfical , lowpaying, no room for advancement job about 1100 every 2 weeks for 80 hrs,

if you make a game or a website that takes you 80 hrs then charge about 1500-2000 bucks.

I just made 26.8 bucks an hour for 6 hours tonite updating a site that i built, now thats pretty good for an update, since I got paid for building the site as well.

For my main job I do remodeling and addtions

just gave a bid for a basment being framed up, its going to take me about 4 days by my self and I will make about 1200.00 bucks and thats 4 4 hour shifts so really 16 -20 hours for 1200 that comes out to be about 60 bucks an hour, now thats still cheap compare to most contractors

its all about time, time is money, figure what you would make for that time spent at a normal job, and double it , cuz thats why your in the business to make money right? and not everyone is a flash programmer right/ so if they want the game, then they will pay for it,

the problem here, is no one wants to spend money,

cheapys here

[small_lard]

I've gone through all the links here, and i can't deny that every one has been helpful. It tells me how to price a website, and that there is no industry standard. But the thing is, that's all most newbs here need.

Alrighty, somebody who is experienced in web design: Give all us n00bs an approximate "average" price for an "average" website. That means pretty good work by a fairly decent developer, for a client who's not to picky. Just an average is all i'm looking for. A general guide-line.

And if you say "there is no average", then i could respond "so like, 30 bucks". so you see what i mean?


EDIT: er...meant to post this in that stickied pricing topic. I'm new to the forum, and i must've hit a wrong button somewhere down the line.

Edit2: I merged your post into this thread.

[JabezStone]

OK... an average would be less that $1,000 per hour and more than $1 per hour.

Seriously, the spectrum is so broad you will have a very hard time finding an "average". Here are some figures that people/companies I work with or know charge...

$15/hr
$30/hr
$35/hr
$45/hr
$57.50/hr
$100/hr
$135/hr
$150/hr

...and those are just a few. I am not going to re-post all the thoughts that have been posted in this thread, but I will restate one simple rule of thumb... Charge what 1)you are willing to accept and 2)what your customer is willing to pay. When it comes down to it, unless both of those are fulfilled, nobody will be happy.

It goes without saying that the more experience/professionalism/quality you can offer, the more you can reasonably expect to charge.

[PCRIDE]

for a basic info business card webpage for info, HTML

charge 500-800 include hosting and updating for 4 months

Then

about 120 bucks a year hosting
or 12.00 a month, when hosting is actually 3.95

so you still make money

they never update the site within the 4 months


flash

700 bucks, or more


add shopping carts and forms per hour just figure it in

around 350.00 for Zen cart (free) then you just configure it

or 1500.00 for a real merchant account shopping cart that will be desgined by you.

thats what i charge and it works fine.

[small_lard]

cool, Thanks.

[bart otj]

a friend who wants to get into webdesign and so is looking for starter jobs showed me this website the other day:
http://www.webdesignforums.net/request_a_service_88/

if you take a look at a couple of the threads there you'll see people are asking for sometimes quite complicated websites for a couple of hundred US dollars. i couldn't believe it. i had told my friend what i thought about those sort of prices and he sent one of the guys an email saying that the site the guy wanted was worth more like $1000-1500. he got an email saying that was way over the top and every website the guy had ever had made for him had cost him less than $200, including www.worldofkj.com (this is one of the threads still there). now i'm not saying that website is great, but i certainly wouldn't have done it for 200 bucks.

i just don't understand how so many designers are charging so little... what's going on!

[MG315]

there's many reasons people undercharge (at least from our perspective) for their work:
- they live somewhere that has a low cost of living (the cause of outsourcing). If they only need $200/month to live on, they won't need to charge as much as someone who needs $2000/mon, or someone who needs $20000/mon
- web design isn't their job; its just a hobby. some people design sites just because they like doing it, so they charge just enough to break even.
- they are starting out and want to build up a portfolio. if its your first site, no one's gonna pay you full market value because they don't know how good you are.
- they don't know they could charge more. people who get their work through sites like elance, competing against others with very low cost of living (india, china) see the going rate of sites as quite low, and just go with the flow.

I think its irrelevant to compare your prices to others (in most respects). I don't care that someone is charging $200 for a website that I would charge $5000 for (don't take this as a quote for that site; i didn't even look at it, just an example). I charge what I feel I should charge. It is based on how much I think I'll work on the project (this is different for everyone) and how much I value my time. I also avoid web development projects under $1K because I have never had a web development job that required less than $1000 worth of work (either in actual development work, revisions, client communications, or problems caused by the client like scope creep).


I know you can find people to develop sites real cheap, I've used a few to contract out some work I didn't want to do. But the problem isn't the money, it's the type of people you attract. When you work with a client who picks you solely on your low price, you usually will leave with a bad experience. The less they pay, the more they want, and the less chance you'll get paid. at least that's been my experience...

[bart otj]

that there is a Good Answer. thanks.

[Orkar]

there's many reasons people undercharge (at least from our perspective) for their work:

I know you can find people to develop sites real cheap, I've used a few to contract out some work I didn't want to do. But the problem isn't the money, it's the type of people you attract. When you work with a client who picks you solely on your low price, you usually will leave with a bad experience. The less they pay, the more they want, and the less chance you'll get paid. at least that's been my experience...

So true, I've hit this topic many times and agree with your entire post a few posts back.

If the offer is for peanuts, only monkeys will take it.

[PCRIDE]

old

[Orkar]

for PCRIDE

hmmm, no website present... but a link to nowhere... very OLD content....

POSER

see ya freak boy...

[PCRIDE]

Poser, uh, that an old one. My site has nothing to do with this post. And so what if the content is old and outdated. I don't have time to sit and design a site all day when i do other IT stuff.


I work on what makes money at the present time, not worry about a lame computer company site that makes no money. And to answer the age old question," how much to charge for<Blank>


Charge enough to make money as if you did this as your current job. Also consider how good you are.

45-65 per hour US $$ is a good wage to start out at.

[PCRIDE]

Well put.... couldn't agree anymore!!!

there's many reasons people undercharge (at least from our perspective) for their work:
- they live somewhere that has a low cost of living (the cause of outsourcing). If they only need $200/month to live on, they won't need to charge as much as someone who needs $2000/mon, or someone who needs $20000/mon
- web design isn't their job; its just a hobby. some people design sites just because they like doing it, so they charge just enough to break even.
- they are starting out and want to build up a portfolio. if its your first site, no one's gonna pay you full market value because they don't know how good you are.
- they don't know they could charge more. people who get their work through sites like elance, competing against others with very low cost of living (india, china) see the going rate of sites as quite low, and just go with the flow.

I think its irrelevant to compare your prices to others (in most respects). I don't care that someone is charging $200 for a website that I would charge $5000 for (don't take this as a quote for that site; i didn't even look at it, just an example). I charge what I feel I should charge. It is based on how much I think I'll work on the project (this is different for everyone) and how much I value my time. I also avoid web development projects under $1K because I have never had a web development job that required less than $1000 worth of work (either in actual development work, revisions, client communications, or problems caused by the client like scope creep).


I know you can find people to develop sites real cheap, I've used a few to contract out some work I didn't want to do. But the problem isn't the money, it's the type of people you attract. When you work with a client who picks you solely on your low price, you usually will leave with a bad experience. The less they pay, the more they want, and the less chance you'll get paid. at least that's been my experience...

[SuperSrScripter]

When you charge more, people treat you like an expert; they dont push you around as much. Would you recieve advice from a doctor and reply,"Well, since you are charging $50 for this hip replacement, I am not going to trust you." Sure you would. However, "Well, since you are charging me $20,000 (made up number), I'll take your word for it."

there's many reasons people undercharge (at least from our perspective) for their work:
- they live somewhere that has a low cost of living (the cause of outsourcing). If they only need $200/month to live on, they won't need to charge as much as someone who needs $2000/mon, or someone who needs $20000/mon
- web design isn't their job; its just a hobby. some people design sites just because they like doing it, so they charge just enough to break even.
- they are starting out and want to build up a portfolio. if its your first site, no one's gonna pay you full market value because they don't know how good you are.
- they don't know they could charge more. people who get their work through sites like elance, competing against others with very low cost of living (india, china) see the going rate of sites as quite low, and just go with the flow.

I think its irrelevant to compare your prices to others (in most respects). I don't care that someone is charging $200 for a website that I would charge $5000 for (don't take this as a quote for that site; i didn't even look at it, just an example). I charge what I feel I should charge. It is based on how much I think I'll work on the project (this is different for everyone) and how much I value my time. I also avoid web development projects under $1K because I have never had a web development job that required less than $1000 worth of work (either in actual development work, revisions, client communications, or problems caused by the client like scope creep).


I know you can find people to develop sites real cheap, I've used a few to contract out some work I didn't want to do. But the problem isn't the money, it's the type of people you attract. When you work with a client who picks you solely on your low price, you usually will leave with a bad experience. The less they pay, the more they want, and the less chance you'll get paid. at least that's been my experience...

[badgirl]

Listen, there are so many freaking do it yourself crappy services out there that they are squeezing the very life out of real web developers. In addition, the major companies are turning their secretaries and stupid bean counters into quasi web developers. It's enough to make you sick. None of these people are skilled and in many cases many of them have never even created a webpage. I have run into a few who couldn't even spell HTML. But, they are in charge. Oh yeah, they are in charge but they haven't a freaking clue what they are in charge of. So, I suggest if you have a client negotiate with him/her for a long term contract. I believe it is better to get (for example) $500.00 down for set up and design and then charge a $49.95 per month for maintenance and upgrades on an annual contract than to try to get $1,000.00 up front. That's just my 2 cents worth though.