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Thread: mediatemple.net

  1. #21
    free-webmaster-resource.com deamothul's Avatar
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    Originally posted by ex-static
    why are they using flash when it could be done just as easily with animated gifs?
    OMG how can somebody that that........ walks away shocked.....

  2. #22
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    Originally posted by villain2
    Oh please, who in this day and age, that actually looks at the internet as something of an important tool, doesn't have flash now?
    Have you read what the guy is saying?
    There are companies who won't let their employees install flashplayers on their computers.
    So that group of users won't be able to navigate your site.

    Do you realize the interweb isn't all about kiddies in search of the latest aftereffected button menu.

    There's also the point of bringing information in a clear and effective way without disabling a group of people from viewing that information.


    "It has as much ability to entertain as it does to inform."
    Indeed, and there's a place and time for everything. But why does 90% of today's designers thinks the only reason for a site is to impress and entertain?
    Here's a nice phrase for you people... Stop decorating, start communicating.


    And now don't come here telling about the 'un-talented-un-artistic-dorks' movement.

    Tell me what's so talented and artistic about following a one-style-fits-all approach to a website. Cause that's what it is with these 2A-like ubertechno interfaces. And now on top they make us wait another 15 seconds just to show they found that cool aftereffects tutorial for creating those buttons every other designer is using.

    Wake up!

  3. #23
    Perverse Futurist villain2's Avatar
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    First off, this thread is dead because the splash page has been changed there anyway but ...

    Do you realize the interweb isn't all about kiddies in search of the latest aftereffected button menu.
    did you not read what I wrote? I said the web is as much entertainment as it is information. BOTH, not one or the other. Try reading.

    Here's a nice phrase for you people... Stop decorating, start communicating.
    TV commercials, watch them, understand advertising.

    Tell me what's so talented and artistic about following a one-style-fits-all approach to a website. Cause that's what it is with these 2A-like ubertechno interfaces. And now on top they make us wait another 15 seconds just to show they found that cool aftereffects tutorial for creating those buttons every other designer is using.
    Nothing is talented about one-style-fits-all, but there's also nothing talented about no-style-at-all either. Oh no, you have to WAIT for something ... I think those people that make video games and dvd's should learn from that too ... loading, God, why do I have to be PATIENT for FIVE SECONDS!?!?

    Most animations load while the content is already on the page. Get over it.

    I am so tired of the lack of style shown in websites by the "less-is-more" crowd. Yes, sometimes less is more (ie. sites that are over-chromed) but sometimes less is just less too.

    But maybe I'll take the suggestion and I'll just leave the web design world because if it's going to turn into some bland, by-the-books, flat, static medium where all we care about it putting words on a screen and to hell with any entertainment, animation, storytelling, advertising or creativity because of 1001 different download considerations ... what do we have ... a virtual newspaper with even less visual appeal.

    Wake up? How about move forward.
    Last edited by villain2; 07-23-2004 at 09:28 AM.

  4. #24
    Life moves at 63 fps. mr. freak's Avatar
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    "sense" -

    As a working web designer, I'm sure you know that some clients are focused on getting their info across as efficiently as possible, whereas others are more focused on getting across enough, but doing it with a high degree of style. And then personal sites really ARE more entertainment than information; frankly, all a design studio site really needs is a name, an email address, a simple list of links to past work, and a 2-5 sentence basic description. But that's really boring. So many people flesh it out with silly extra information and flashy (or calming, or creepy) shows of talent in the form of buttons and transitions and carefully constructed interfaces.

    Basically, the web is evolving, and now creating a site that's as much about being cool as it is communication is valid in the marketplace. Or, at least that's what I see.

    There's no need to be so angry
    Be Happy.
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  5. #25
    Perverse Futurist villain2's Avatar
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    -- angry --



    No, it's early in the morning here and the last thing I wanted to read (after going through the 9-11 commission report, well 110 pages of it last night) was yet another person who can't see the value of both sides of an issue.

    Bottom line, websites, if they're going to move forward as a medium unto itself and NOT tv or microfiche or newspaper etc. etc. is to embrace and learn that it has the unique ability to educate, inform AND advertise all within the same medium.

    Some people want to keep it as a static series of pages, flat and "simple". Others want to act like it's a place to show how 3D they can really get. Then, there are those in the middle who understand the value of both ... too bad those people are few and far between ... at least on here.

    In fact, I think Aversion is the only other person on here who I've ever seen state something similar to that.

  6. #26
    Life moves at 63 fps. mr. freak's Avatar
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    No, no, you're not angry, "sense" is. I agree with you.
    Be Happy.
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  7. #27
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    Villain2, the same (nice battle). Now I will team up with you and leave b/c I can not be creative and must develop crappy HTML sites with animated gifs and tiled backgrounds for the 1% of idiots still running IE or Netscape version 1.

    By the way, my prof was very impressed with my prez. It was titled "Flash: more than animation". I am even getting extra credit plus he wanted a copy. Not bad.

    The following is a real life example (e-mail) of the crap I have to put up with from this 1% group:

    "I recently visited www.jscfcu.org and was dismayed to find a new site design with Macromedia Flash applications plastered all over it. A lot of people prefer not to use Flash applications due to their annoying behavior and pop-up style invasion of the web surfing experience. Flash is great for advertisements and cutesy cartoons, but has very little use on a credit union website. Proper website development should at least include a non-flash version of the site."

    By the way, this was recieved by a person with the title "Sr. Applications Software Engineer". Now what they need to do is stick there nose back in there cubicle and never come out.

    Where is he coming from with this statement "A lot of people prefer not to use Flash applications due to their annoying behavior and pop-up style invasion of the web surfing experience." What "annoying behavior" and "pop-up style invasion of the web surfing experience". Give me a break and get a life. Oh wait, I think I here your Cobal program calling. Get back to work!

    Web development is way different than software engineering. You are creating user experiences and trying to make the sell. You are not just writing code. People matter in this line of work.

    The reason we used Flash for the navigation bars on this website is b/c we were able to compress the files to make them smaller than animated gifs (this is just another great use of flash). Plus, by using Flash everything loads smoother and is not "broken" like ani gifs would cause.

    Also, the files were published in Flash 5 so that people would not have to download the Flash 7 player. We also used HTML links at the bottom of the homepage for people to navigate to their accounts.

    In conclusion, there is no reason for people to complain about Flash being used on a website if used for the right reasons. These people make up a small % of your market and will complain about anything and everything. Trust me... they complained a few years ago when the site used frames and tables.

    But let us not forget that "Sr. Applications Software Engineers" know everything about web development.
    Last edited by pastthepresent; 07-23-2004 at 09:50 AM.
    "Leading the business of today into the future of tomorrow"

  8. #28
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    I got nothing against entertaining or well designed sites.

    What thicks me of is people following certain styles blindly without even thinking about the target/subject of the website.

    They know that if they use pixelpattern backgrounds and dirty grungebrushes their site will be awarded or respected in the designcomunity.

    Most awardsites do add to that trend with only awarding sites that fullfill at certain designtrends.
    They bring across the wrong message in my opinion.

    So we end up with same looking interfaces for completely different type of sites.

    If you call me uncreative or hating for that, ok.

    But in my opinion the last thing you should think about is your site being respected by the designcommunity (if it isn't your targetaudience).
    That's something most people won't realise and is what I get angry about.


    btw I don't find it annoying to wait for a website to load and surprise me with entertaining design, content or navigation but I do find it annoying if turns out I was waiting for another aftereffected played out buttonset.
    Last edited by sense; 07-23-2004 at 10:15 AM.

  9. #29
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    But in my opinion the last thing you should think about is your site being respected by the designcommunity
    I agree. The last thing I care about is winning design awards. Those are not going to get me my next client. Designing for the target market and delivering what your client wants will get you next job.
    "Leading the business of today into the future of tomorrow"

  10. #30
    You can argue back and forth forever about whether this site is whoring out the lastest pixel design net-trends. It's all opinion and that fine. Personally, I like that site, it looks clean and professional.

    The use of flash, whether to use or not etc. might be great for another debate, but this is coolsites for flash. I don't see the point in debating that in this forum, but hey I still don't have a problem with that.

    But then communication and target audience is mentioned and how they are dropping these infavour of cliched techno design. Well guess what? Mediatemple is still in business, raking in cash and clients. So while we can all rant and moan about the site, wehter it should be gif or flash, whether the interface is like everything else, I think it's pretty presumptious to go talking about how they're not properly targetting their audience or communicating, when the FACT IS, they still have clients, and are still making money.

    Mediatemple is a server business, not a designhouse. The bottom line is to make money (ie. not push new design trends) This site helps them to make money. And for any of us outsiders to go knocking on their business plan and marketing without and knowledge of their sales stats... Well I just don't find that fair.

    DONT get me wrong...Critique the style, debate the use of flash, its all fair game. But to knock on them for apparently not properly targetting their audience? Well what can I say, they're making money, so they must be doing something right.

  11. #31
    Perverse Futurist villain2's Avatar
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    NEWSFLASH, I actually agree with something "sense" said:

    What thicks me of is people following certain styles blindly without even thinking about the target/subject of the website.
    If that's what you're talking about then I definately agree. You can't make a site that's about say an animal shelter in an over-chromed-rave-style.

    I think for the most part that most business sites like that of media Temple could benefit from Flash animations here and there ... not everywhere. They're best used for buttons, demos and promotions.

    Of course, it was those style of sites that made me want to get into web design. I used to think of websites as being something where you could write stuff and put up a picture or two. Then, I got the Flash 5 book and saw Eric Jordan's 2nd version of 2A, and yes, it changed my perception of what the web could be.

    Don't mimick his sites, but you can adopt the style. The style, however, is not for everything. All sites are different, and certain styles are more suited than others.

    I do agree though, that the topic of whether or not flash should be used on certain sites is kind of backwards. We're not making text documents here, afterall. We're making interactive experiences (note the word interactive, not overbearing).

  12. #32

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    mediatemple is keeping it real.
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  13. #33
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    Media Temple's target audience are (or at least their cached audience, are) mainly designers. So they use technology that their target audience uses.

    The above posts crying about the use of flash here and citing targetting user audiences is kinda redundant, wouldn't you think ?

    A bandwagon is only a bandwagon when enough people jump on it to make it roll.

    Never lose sight of a design's target audience, Media Temple haven't...there is nothing to argue about here.

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