Amorphium PRO website up with Flash examples...

[newtheory]

Hmmm, I'm not quite sure what advantage Am. Pro would have over my 3ds Max and Illustrate and Vecta ect. I know, its cheaper, but if I already shelled out the money...? I'll try downloading it, and see what I think, but I agree that the edges and quality seems a little shakey...Might be good for some rough stuff though.

Hans

[worldwideman]

Here you go try this one...

20 frames box over plane with gradients on with shawdows! 6kb

http://platter.anapraxis.com/galleri...ium/block2.swf

Best regards...

[Mr K]

Yeah okay....not bad, but the animation still looks like it's jumping around a bit.

Lets see what I can do with that ....

Hmm well Okay I can't do the shadow, but I do get a smother animation.

Can someone with the Vecta 3D Plugin or the Illustrate plugin grab either of these files and render them out? Thanks

http://www15.brinkster.com/MrK/_Demo/Box-02.3DS
http://www15.brinkster.com/MrK/_Demo/Box-02.max

[Pope de Flash]

I dont think the power of amorphium is the render engine. Swift has that gradient thing kinda SWEET. I think its the ablity to do real modeling within the program that will attract many people. Simple cubes and the like will be best done in Swift. Its going to be the level of modeling you are going to have to do that will determine what you use. To robot could be done in Swift no doubt but it would take quite some time. The blob example on the other hand could only be done if you did it in Max and exported the lighting etc as a 3DS model.

So the real question will come down to not "What does a rendered cuble look like" but "what type of modeling am I going to do" and "do I want to spend $149 or $384" I will have a product review of Amorphium up in just a few days here at the Kit. I will make a post when its ready. Its modeling capabilitys are top notch, its render situation is not as tight as the Swift stuff as you can see in the examples on the amorphium page and the cube above.

I like both products but will be doing a side by side comparison of the two products in the review. I'll post when the review is up and runing. Regards, Bill

[worldwideman]

I agree with this. Amorphium is so much more than a Flash renderer! It has so many capabilities above and beyond a file converter. Look at the renders for just images and animations... Amorphium has raytracing and radiosity also! No other product offers so much bang for the buck.


"I dont think the power of amorphium is the render engine. Swift has that gradient thing kinda SWEET. I think its the ablity to do real modeling within the program that will attract many people."

[Mr K]

Yeah this is true...

I'm keen to see your review of this product.

Thanks

[Attwood]

I just wish there was an *upgrade* for old users of Amorphium, I have Amorphium, but not the latest, I would hate to go pay the money for the same program I have but with more features, but hey, that is how life is, buy the program, re-buy the next version.

Later
--William

[dynamic-dev]

Someone mentioned vecta- here's my two cents about the standalone, not the plugin-

Although Vecta 3D is not modeling software, it does a pretty good job of extruding 2d vectors, and is not bad with rendering simpler models. At $60 US, I'd say it's well worth it.

Here's a 3KB example of a box exported from flash, imported into Vecta 3D Standalone, saved as a .3ds, opened in Vecta 3D Standalone Gradient Shader (included for $60), rendered as a .swf with two lights, imported into flash and exported from flash as the directions recommend. It's a lot of playing around to get any shading correct, and it does have some other smaller quirks but it's a cheap date...what'ya expect.

For $400, I dunno.....we'll have to see....

hope this helps somebody somewhere who wanted to know
George


http://www.dynamic-dev.com/3Dcube

[ClydeTheGlyde]

After seeing this I don't think anybody needs to bother with Vector 3D programs.


These Vector3D vendors can't spin 2 complex objects with 500KB and they want me to shell out how much?.

[OpieNC]

ok. here is my 2 cents.

I think that swift does the best job of shading, and possibly the smoothest rotations. the interface is intuitive and easy to navigate. with docking ability, it can adjust to any screen resolution. it can model tons of things. if you are extruding objects, it is great. it does not have a large amount of primitives, but with creativity lots of things can be done. I personally own swift and 3d SM, and I do not think I need anything else. both programs work incredibly smooth and they do the job I want them to. 3d SM is the premier modeling program, and I think that swift is number 1 in rendering to 3d in vector, even though it can take a while. version 2 should be out within the next few months and all previously stated problems have been adressed. the rendering engine is going to be more powerful and the modeling will be extended.

as for the file size problem with swift, I have created many animations less than 4k that have polygon counts over 5,000 with over 4,000 edges. the capabilities of programs, such as those mentioned in this thread, is what all designers need to keep in mind. I know that swift CAN pump out hefty file sizes, so I do not do positioning tweens unless it is the light, and after importing into flash I often break the frames apart and then let flash refigure the geometry to produce in some cases 8 times as small file sizes with are shading used.

Amorphium pro might be a great program, but I am not impressed. there are better programs out there. you can download free programs to render into 3ds format, and then use swift to import the 3ds then manipulate it how you see fit, then export. --Professional grade modeling with the best 3d vector rendering for 140$.

[vpcg]

Originally posted by OpieNC
Amorphium pro might be a great program, but I am not impressed. there are better programs out there. you can download free programs to render into 3ds format, and then use swift to import the 3ds then manipulate it how you see fit, then export. --Professional grade modeling with the best 3d vector rendering for 140$.

I'm curious OpieNC... Have you use Amorphium Pro at all?

Rendering flash files is not all it does.

I agree that there are better programs out there for certain things, but if you've played with the demo at all you'll see that Amorphium Pro is not a "traditional" modeling tool. It is built around a "clay sculpting" metaphor. Allowing you to work with objects organically by pushing, pulling, smear, and smooth the polygons by simply clicking and dragging a paint brush style tool. Sure... there are other programs that might be a better choice for modeling in the "traditional" sense (curves, patches, booleans, etc..), but when it comes to organic objects, nothing on the market comes close.(unless you fork out the money for Maya and use the Artisan plug-in)

It is a completely different type of modeling tool and makes it possible to create objects that would be too hard or too difficult anywhere else.

[Bielzebubba]

No need for Maya, Animation Master is by far the best organic character modeler and animation program and it's only $299.


And Clyde has a point. When somebody shows me a game like that or something other than rotating objects I may consider Vector 3D programs again.

I do have Vecta and Swift by the way, I was stupid enough to waste money on both.

[peltonen]

I'm not experienced with every 3D tool available as some here... never had access to use Maya and never owned Max.. but I will say this. Amorphium seems to be about the fastest modeler I have used. It's easy to spank objects out quickly. Good point about its organic stuff, I've so far spent more time with the booleans and fxs. look forward to actually saving my renders with the real deal soon though.

pelt

[uglytroll]

Originally posted by peltonen
I'm not experienced with every 3D tool available as some here... never had access to use Maya and never owned Max.. but I will say this. Amorphium seems to be about the fastest modeler I have used. It's easy to spank objects out quickly. Good point about its organic stuff, I've so far spent more time with the booleans and fxs. look forward to actually saving my renders with the real deal soon though.

pelt

Hi, everybody, from Spain (sorry my grammar)!

I did buy long time ago. Amorphium. It was really hard to make it come to my country. Because I did buy it to a reseller in France, which was contacted by an spanish company. Thinking that way would come quicker. It took almost two months.

But I was and I am happy with it. Hope my experience could help people here.

See some -not ended- models made by me from scratch (they were an sphere , a cilinder , and an sphere again, in the begining) :

(just click on "VIEW" button once your'e in share screen, for each file.)

A head (not ended, as all the models.Ear is just started.)
http://www.xdrive.com/share/98061735...d80N7OEj8pACUA
An arm (gif animated, wait a little ;D )
http://www.xdrive.com/share/98061760...3tNTcL07poBCvd
Another head. This one's is just a rough 3d sketch.
http://www.xdrive.com/share/98061771...goFaQc4S1eWU4r



What I can tell about Amorphium 1.

Amorphium is a great modeler for organic tasks. Do not easily find another low cost one like it.

Advantages I see (Amorphium 1.0 from Play. have not tested Pro) :

-With some hard learning, one can model very cool details, and construct everything -organic- one wants to. For rather sharp details (some points in mouth or eyes) one could find problems. It is powerful, however. I was not able to make human heads before (I am cartoonist/realistic illustrator)

-mesh softening. It works great. Unfortunately , exported mesh is not so cool when opened in other packages...I mean, a LightWave (don't know a word about it) or one of those sure produce much nicer mesh. I mean, ordered quads instead of so irregular and a bi ugly triangles, but for me that's not very important (for a 3d animator , maybe)

-Poly reducing. U can paint in greyscales (as well as u can paint vertex, as Ts 3+ can, as well as I have read Max 3.1 also can ...) from black to white...and so, white for the areas u want more polys and vertex, black for very low number of polys and vertex, greys more or less dark depending on mesh density u want in that area. It works, or it did for what I wanted. Masks work with it to protect areas.Masks work for almost any aspect of Amorphium.

-Mesh Painting. Careful, there's a BIG problem (well, see I am gonna mix these with disadvantages, also, to make it short) It does paint vertex. But you are painting vertex color, as far as I have seen it does not create a bitmap texture for the whole object or part you're paintinng (if somebody knows it is posible to create bmps textures from 3d painting in A. 1, please, tell me !) So, two problems. As far as I know, game companies want textures for low polygon models. The only way u have to paint some little detail is increase enourmously the mesh density(it paints each vertex)...but it is difficult that you would be able to aquire precision and soft stroke with wacom that you'll have in 3d painting software like Deep Paint 3d, Mesh paint, or Painter 3d. Great hardware would be needed. And many people would not accept so much high poly stuff. And by the way, this vertex paint would only be used if your gonna use renders for strategy games. But, even so, you cannot export vertex color info if it is not with FACT (Electric image) format or VRML 1 or 2. Vrml exports in Amorphium seem to make some hard modification and polys loosing..it makes it not very well, or it did not for me. FACt..it has not polys limit and it exports with vertex color...but I have not find free converters for FAC format...I think I did not even in comercial sites.

-Animation. Well...for making a rotate, or a cube bouncing, ok, but very limited for anyother thing. I was not angry for that. I bought it after hard studing its features in articles...for its modelling capabilities.

-It is a great modeller, but one has to be patient...It does not allow to merge different objets, u can do this in their metaballs section (A. is divided in sections: texturer, modeller, metaball modeller, animation, masks...(well they're not the exact names)), which is rather worse than Organica's one. Not powerful enough for me.
Instead of it, I did make all starting from a cilinder (the arm) and from an sphere (heads)

-Ok. My final conclusion after LOTS of hours and producing some models is...It is rather useful for modelling organic parts (not so usefull for making a full body from scratch, better do that in TrueSpace (got free 3 with a magazine, Pc Pro Spanish.) and then import it into A., and retouch and make some detail), but if you are patient, and asume it is just a tool to retouch models roughly created in other pacakages u have, them you'll find it useful.

A wacom is helpfull, but not always so helpful. For some tasks , for example, painting vertex, or shape smothing, or some other tasks, it is very good. A cheap mouse however can do the works almost the same.


Well. A great tool. But u got to give a real try. All i have spoken about is Amorphium 1.0. Do not know how much better is Amorphium Pro. I have run to http://www.amorphium.com to see if I have a right to a free upgrade. Sadly not. It is a pitty, 'cause think I could make great things with new tool...

And ..er...
http://www.arrakis.es/~yagodib ,in case u want to see some artwork I made. These are just drawings.

Is this too long for a post ?

[OpieNC]

I am not critiquing the modeling engine. I was expressing my thoughts to the vector results. they are downright sloppy. from the examples given by uglytroll, I thought they were very cool, but that is not vector. this thread was talking about a great new vector tool, not a great new raster tool. I have not tried it at all. I have no desire to. I have 3ds max and love it. I have swift3d for my 3d vectors and flash 4 to throw it all together. from what I have seen/heard, if the modeling engine is so fantastic, why not make the vector animations something to desire. from the cube I was shown, I thought that I could have done better with just flash. I could have gotten a smoother rotation and the gradient they used is nothing but flash's radial gradient. perhaps it is better for me to agree to disagree.

[Pope de Flash]

A little history lesson for you opienc electric image who makes amorphium pro has been around a heck of a lot longer than discreets 3d studio max. 3d Stuido max is not "the premire" 3d Model environment. It is a mid level at best. Before speak know what your talking about.

As far as Amorphium Pro goes its a great modeling environment and its animations are very very smooth. The review of the product is almost done.

Amophium Pro is an excellent program. It is a entry level pro 3D solution. It does great raster rendering as well as the swf output. For a first showing its a solid product. This will cause both Swift and Vecta to mature. This is a good thing. I have been speaking with John Soucie, Senior Engineer at erain about this and they are not worried about it at all.

Right now erain has the gradient render environment as well as an easy straight forward approach to animation.

Amoprhium has the shadows and the ability to create complex models.

Both have strong and weak points I embrace them both. FlashKit would suck if there were no Were-here or flashplanet etc. all have there place and will enjoy a certian market.
[Edited by Pope de Flash on 02-12-2001 at 07:05 PM]