[F8] Orthographic engine with node based pathfinding

[walsher]

Okay, I gotcha. I never would have thought the camera. I guess I never that feature. thanks for info X-Tender and renderhjs.

[everfornever]

why no bump map on the bricks?

[renderhjs]

to be honest I haven´t really thought about that,- I´ll give it a try next time

[iopred]

Renderhjs, for your pathfinding step, it sounds like you're doing a very inefficient search, have you considered using A*? It is quite easy to implement, and is one of the faster searches with a good heuristic.

Also, great work, it is a fantastic demo you have going, I am thoroughly impressed.

[mr_malee]

i'm quite interested in this node based pathfinding stuff now, looks like a challenge. I agree with iopred, i think if you used a heuristic on the search it would eliminate those other paths which it finds.

i'm interested in the merging of nodes, how to determine what nodes need to be merged...

[XareoX]

Nice game and i like the graphics alot but i havent played the game yet cos a error message came up when i got in the elevator its working better now nice game it looks like you put a lot of effort into this game its proberly the best rendering flash game iv seen on flashkit =P takes awile 2 load tho

[XareoX]

what do u do any way ?? Sry if u have instructions i normaly dont read them i just want to play the game

[EvilKris]

Nice tutorial/guide there. You should post it online somewhere for posterity.

[programicks]

Wow, the graphics, 3d and pathfinding are stunning. Cannot wait to see more.

MichaelUK

[renderhjs]

i did it the way I could think of - to give you an answer I´d first have to look deeply into the A* again. Though I think my method for collecting the paths is not so bad,- I thought of several logics to exclude dead ending or long paths.
oh and thanks for your compliment,- I am very honored


I created a demo/ editor tool just to find out more about the pathfinding method. In that editor tried merging nodes automaticly by just analysing the nodes to each other like what distance they have to each other - and if I´d remove one- if other nodes had enough connections to save the nodes that were connected with the one to be deleted.
However from my expierence even the automatic node- finding/ placement takes to much CPU power (lots of loops to go through) and also you cant automate everything like when you want unique scenarios (like isolating nodes with different zones).

@ XareoX:
no at the moment there aren´t yet that much instruction you need to know,-the first post was merely to show the technology. Its also the reason why I haven´t shown much of the levels so far.
At this stage I even haven´t decided how much gameplay elements I will include (like collecting objects, unlocking doors, healtbar,...). Some other ideas will certainly make it in the final stage- like secret areas you can discover (I have for example to show somehow my nude drawings,- but I could hide them in a way regular people wont access them- and i´d be even a bigger surprise)


so I improved a little,- update:
http://www.burg-halle.de/~st2520/

so what improved/ changed?

z- Depth sorting:

I enabled it again,- and improved it in a way that so that only labeled parts will be included in the sorting. Every object can have a zD (z- Depth) value that enables shifting in the zDepth dimension. I need this because some sprites or objects dont start from the bottom or are extra large.

this screenshot shows the z-Depth sorting- all crates a seperate sprites (with the same orgin) and do rotate independent. Some crates are on a higher z- Depth, those needed this zD value so that their z-Depth position would affect cover other crates below them.
However there are still situations like this:

where (always faces) cover sprites or other faces.
The Turquoise dotted lines show the z- Depth of the face (2 doors) and the player. Obviously the player´s index is below the face one- that´s why in this case the player covers the face. I avoid situations like this currently by dividing the face into 2 seperate faces wich are booth smaler and thus dont force a situation like this so often.

gameplay

I added this spot thingy that shows where the player is walking ahead to

I think this feature helps navigating/ understanding where the player is headed to- esspecialy if the camera changes position during the walk. Some of you suggested to enable direct camera control (keyboard,...) not only for the control I assume but also for a better overview. However this is more to my liking (see other way around below...).

Camera control,
So I played with the ideas you gave me,- and tried to implent some kind of camera control- but I dont know If I like it- it doesn´t always feel natural, sometimes the mouse can be to fast or abrupt and so does the camera in this case.

So how does it work,- in debug mode you now can see 2 green lines. If you hover outside of the middle part between those 2 lines the camera rotates depending on how far you move the mouse from the center away (you dont need the debug mode to rotate the camera this way). Anyway this thing causes still some bugs like placing the charcter in the air if you leave the flash movie or things like that.

[EvilKris]

How about this idea?
Scrap the web-portfolio and instead make the world's first Flash Resident Evil clone...?
Everyone loves a good zombie game!

[renderhjs]

well maybe nice but not original,- I need this kind of site to apply for an agency here (pretty much broke again this month, student live = hard). For some game elements I had MetalGearSolid in mind (like the idea of camera zones). But creating a complete (good) game would take in this case even more time- i´d first like to complete this portfolio site to finally again let others show my works.


I thought I´d show some pics about the texture baking

1.) I first rebuild the scene (wich goes pretty quick
2.) apply the textures (just dragging the files on the planes
3.) add some invisible objects that cast shadows- to make the final light effects look more interesing.
4.) for each face: goto the render to texture dialogue and render a complete map texture


the final result


I used the invisible objects and lights as xref scene (reference scene) on the pilar object to have the same light settings and same objects around that cast shadows.
So its like having the pilaster in the level scene- same light values + shadows

once I am done I need to update the pilaster sprite movie and reload the scene in Flash


update:
http://www.burg-halle.de/~st2520/
changes:
- removed extended camera control (the experimental thing I included before)
- green spot thingy icon now blinks if you set a path
- cage box around info objects
- finished that china room (1st level that loads this time)- you can leave the room and get back to the elevator
- the elevator now can be left aswell- it will load the previous map then.

[renderhjs]

... I re- did the character now in 16 directions! (before just 8) and it just takes 20 KB more in space as the previous version with 8 directions. Currently the system SWF is about 335 KB wich includes the character renderings and the elevator menu GFX and of course lots of code

[ozmic66]

beautiful work. looks like you have a bunch of really interesting topics to talk about, maybe you should start some sort of blog

[pentru]

agree w/ ozmic.....you brounght some needed freshness and inspiration to this board, and definitely raised the bar in game dev w/ what you're showing here in terms of mechanics and graphics.....really nice work....hope it'll turn into a playable game at some point, since you definitely have the core mechanics and graphics down pretty well

I do a lot of work w/ Max in my day job, and even though I know about texture baking and how it works, I never really experimented w/ it for my work.....I'll have to give it a shot see if we can include it in our pipeline process.....

thanks for the sharing all the good stuff

paul.

[renderhjs]

a blog is more isolated compared to a place like this - besides I am in a stage where I need people to discuss with.
For my university I prepared lots of screenshots (from the very beginning) and of notes that will document my development.

I thank you very much


In that case I might have some usefull techniques- might post some of them as I find a some time for that.

little update:
http://www.burg-halle.de/~st2520/
my university started so the past days were a little bit busy, I have written less code but instead worked on the levels and the graphics today.

The spot thingy now has a exploding ring animation once you click on the ground (more clear now where the action happens)

changed the outer html frame:

(clouds, little extra colors, different bottom)

I added another level online called 'pencil drawings' with some pencil drawings I did
In this level I tried some new things like
- the animated dust/ volume light
- bump mapping on the walls (not flash,- but in the process of texture baking)
- sprites that cast light shadows on walls (used matte materials for that), although you cant see it perfectly in this level



I thought about more game elements and I have an Idea on how to implement a item manegement for the levels. Meaning beeing able to pickup and use items that can be found in the levels.
For that purpose I would need to check each time before loading the level wich item actions (e.g. pick up, drop, destroy, move, switch,....) happend in the past (save as flash cookie) and execute those before initing the level (because for example newer dropped items need to be loaded aswell). To ensure compatibility of a newer object or level version I´d need to campare the absolute Id´s for each object.
I´d be nice to have some objects that really can change the environment. Like a spray can that can vandalise my drawings, or some coins that let you use a cell phone or vending machine wich continue to more possibilities. The difficulty will be to limit the ideas in order to finish it sometime

[renderhjs]

finished yet the eye´s painting of the thief.

and I am really happy with the results- he really looks pretty serious and his slim nose makes him even more appealing

I have to admit that it I was slightly inspired from the 'last ninja' a c64 game from the very beginning for this project, and when I finished today the face I was a little bit shocked how much it resembles the 'last ninja'


I will use this painted splash screen while preloading the engine or levels. Maybe I´ll paint another layer so that I could animate some light/shadow on his face that way it will look like he´s moving inside the lift.

[renderhjs]

I made a little animation (resized gif here)

with opening and closing eyes

[Captain_404]

Every time I see this I'm blown away, it's just not that often that you see a truly 3d looking flash game (or navigation I guess)

It's been said before, but I'll say it again: this definately needs to be made into some type of game.

[trogdor458]

gah! you know for a moment i thought you were actually using flash to make the 3d (from reading all your posts with the 3d images), but i see now that it's made with some pc cg program that i will NEVER be able to pull off (i dont have any money....) on my mac here, i believe that the graphics are the most impressive things here yes? you spent a heck of alot of time on those cg models?, my browsers told me something about security so i havent viewed it yet. darn, the best 3d thing i can come up with is a 3d sphere with transparent parts that let you see inside as well as shadowing effects that move according to your mouse (looks pretty nice when used on something small) but i dont think even half the people here have what it takes to make something like that (either they dont have enough experience, skill, or money...)

dang, the walls ARE 3d, hmm unfortunately this would be near impossible for me to pull off with flash 5, though technically it IS possible. who am i kidding, i dont think i would want a game that complex