BILL O'REILLY, HOST: Now for the Top Story tonight, another apparent erosion in the teaching of American history. There are some educators in Texas who want a different academic slant on the Alamo.

Fox News correspondent Douglas Kennedy sets it up for us.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DOUGLAS KENNEDY, FOX CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Remember the Alamo, the battle cry chiding Texans not to forget its war for independence with Mexico. Still, how Texans remember the Alamo, as well as Texas history, may be changing.

ANGELA MILLER, HOUSTON SCHOOL DISTRICT: We don't want our Hispanic kids, or any kids, to feel like we are teaching a biased approach.

KENNEDY: Teaching changes as the state's population changes. Over 40 percent of the students in Texas are now Hispanic, most tracing their heritage to Mexico. A new curriculum still teaches Texas independence, but, say administrators, without the traditional us-versus-them Texas perspective.

MILLER: We are all in this together, basically. And "we" includes those Hispanic kids who are now in our district, who have a heritage from Mexico.

KENNEDY (on camera): In war, they say, history is written by those who won. The question in today's multicultural Texas, can history be rewritten for those who lost?

At the Brady Middle School in Houston, Douglas Kennedy, Fox News.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'REILLY: Joining us now from Houston is Jose Fernandez, the president of the Mexican Cultural Institute in that city.

So I got a problem with this, Mr. Fernandez, and I'll tell you why. I always was taught in school that the Alamo was basically a battle between 189 Texans and 2,000 Mexican troops, and it showed the heroism of those Texans.

Now, my teachers didn't involved in the politics of what was going on between Mexico and the United States at that time, which was very complicated. It basically was a heroism lesson. And I see nothing wrong with that. Do you?

JOSE FERNANDEZ, HOUSTON MEXICAN CULTURAL INSTITUTE: No, it was a battle for independence.

O'REILLY: Yes, by the Texans. They wanted to -- they didn't want to be under the thumb of Mexico City. But it was also a battle of courage, because the Mexicans, quite frankly, didn't have to attack the Alamo. They could have starved them out or just, you know, surrounded them, and they weren't a threat to the 2,000 force of Santa Ana.

FERNANDEZ: Well, they could attack the Alamo. I'm not a historian, but they shouldn't have killed the prisoners. That was the problem.

O'REILLY: Which -- who shouldn't have killed the prisoners?

FERNANDEZ: The forces of Santa Ana.

O'REILLY: OK, right. So when we're teaching this, it's going to, they're -- Mexicans are get a black eye no matter what we do. So what's the beef?

FERNANDEZ: Well, but after the Alamo, there was the San Jacinto Battle, in which the Texans massacred the Mexicans who were giving up, who were trying to surrender...

O'REILLY: Payback, right.

FERNANDEZ: ... and they -- even some of them were fleeing in panic, and they were shot from the back. And some of them, at the cry of "Remember the Alamo!" they were shot.

O'REILLY: But as you know, as you know, in every war, in every battle, there are atrocities. So I'm not understanding what the Mexican community wants down in Houston and why you would deemphasize, which is what they're trying to do, the Alamo, because it is an example of courage, is it not?

FERNANDEZ: Yes, but I don't think that the Alamo is the problem. And I don't even think that the...

O'REILLY: The problem for the lady we just heard from, and it's a problem for some educators in Houston, maybe not for you.

FERNANDEZ: Yes, but you have to tell the whole story. And the whole story goes, the actual independence was won at the San Jacinto. And the problem for us, for -- from the cultural point of view is that there are about 600 Mexican soldiers who died in the line of duty, whose remains have never been buried. They are scattered in the marshes, and nobody has even remembered them. And I think it's time that we tell the whole story...

O'REILLY: Why?

FERNANDEZ: ... and that we honor, we honor those soldiers...

O'REILLY: But why, why would any American care about that?

FERNANDEZ: No, I'm talking about the Mexican perspective. Because there are half a million immigrants born in Mexico in Houston, and there are more than a million and a half Hispanics.

O'REILLY: But they're live, if they're living in America, see, I -- look, I'm going to draw a parallel. In, there was heroism in World War II on the German and Japanese side. We don't, we don't teach that here even though are millions of Japanese and German Americans here. We basically say, we won the war, we kicked your butt, and you deserved it to get kicked.

So, I mean, what are we supposed to do, in every war, we're supposed to glorify, you know, what happened on the other side? That doesn't make any sense.

FERNANDEZ: No, no, no. I'm not talking about that. I'm saying that in the Mexican culture, honoring the dead is very important. People near -- have to live near their dead ones. In Mexico it's part of a very important...

O'REILLY: All right. But this is the United States...

FERNANDEZ: ... part of the culture.

O'REILLY: ... Mr. Fernandez, it's not part of our culture here.

FERNANDEZ: I know, but...

O'REILLY: If you want to do it, that's fine with me, and you can have your celebrations. But I don't want it in the public school system.

FERNANDEZ: No, no, no. I think that the problem is that you have to tell the whole story, the bad and the right. I think the U.S. has -- since it's the only superpower, it has the obligation to tell the truth.

O'REILLY: But Mr. Fernandez, let's be realistic, now. In a Ph.D. college course, I'm with you all the way. But for high school students and grammar school students who, you know, just get the basics of this, it's the Alamo was heroism, 189 against 2,000, they didn't give up. That's what the lesson is there. There were very, very heroic people in Texas down there, whether they were crazy or right or wrong doesn't seem to matter to me, you know? I'm not getting why you want to fiddle around with the Alamo.

FERNANDEZ: No, but I...

O'REILLY: I'll give you the last word.

FERNANDEZ: I understand what you're saying...

O'REILLY: OK.

FERNANDEZ: ... and I don't think that this is what they want to change in the history. What they want to change in the history is the outcome, really, the outcome, how it happened. Because some of the stories are blown out of proportion, and you have to center in the -- on what happened, really, and then, from my point of view, we have to honor our dead, and...

O'REILLY: But they're not our dead, see, Mr. Fernandez? They may be your dead, but they're not the USA's dead.

FERNANDEZ: They are the dead of a lot of descendants who were living in Houston -- in Texas...

O'REILLY: All right, but this...

FERNANDEZ: ... those soldiers...

O'REILLY: Again, think about this. Get the Germans and the Japanese, the same thing, we're not honoring their dead.

Mr. Fernandez, we appreciate your point of view. Thanks for coming on.

FERNANDEZ: Okay.



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