file size and toons

[mmreed]

http://www.flashtoonz.com

If you look at a few of the cartoons, some of them show the file size as it loads... many of these cartoons are very small in size...yet have much activity and audio...does anyone know how this is accomplished so well?

I know the typical answers of sound bitrates, symbol use, etc... but even following all the canned responses these cartoons seem to have a ton of 'kick' for such little size!

Has anyone done anything like this in KM and can demonstrate a few techniques?

Bob- has there any consideration been given to adding some smoothing level features and pressure sensitive tablet features to KM?

[Bob Hartzell]

Bob- has there any consideration been given to adding some smoothing level features

-> In a swf, the number of points in the morph source must equal the number of points in the morph target and be of the same type (anchor point or curve control point) so reducing points here and there will not be effective unless there is a smart way of reducing points in all the frames.

and pressure sensitive tablet features to KM?

-> What would pressure sensitive control?

[mmreed]

the thickness and stroke of the lines.

What made me think of this is I downloaded a demo of a flash development app called TOON BOOM. It does flash cartooning and has smoothing levels and tablet features to mimic actual drawing.

What i do not like about it is the complexity of the interface... it's timeline and score are not user friendly...but the drawing tools are great.

If KM could blend in these tools it would be one powerhouse of an app!

[porter007]

I concur with mr.reed!


KM is one bad@$$ app(!!!), however, the ability to create lines ove varying thickness and width based on a pressue sensative tablet/pen would make it the KING!

[Richard Ward]

Mark, I too am interested in making compact swf toons. At flashtoonz.com, the piece called "Tree Hugger" was 347 KBs. One way it seems to keep file size low is by re-using symbols to the extreme. It looks like each stump is identical, as is each row of hills and the left arm/hand are a flipped copy of the right (for each position). Also, each movement looked to be done with transforms on symbols, which makes for smaller files. Someday, I hope it will be possible to do morphing/shape-tweening more compactly, but for now, one can afford to use very little of it in a piece of any size.
The big trick is to make all this scrimpimg look like a fuller form of animation. Much skill seems to be required to pull it off well. For example, carefully directing the viewers gaze to the few places one can afford to lavish detail. Good luck getting smaller! I would love to see what you do.

[flashtoonz]

Yep, Richard Ward is right, I tend to reuse my symbols constantly. Something like the "Tree Hugger" the same hills are used constantly. Even the distant ones in the far background are the same but with Alpha channel dissolves put through to fade away etc...I do this for 2 reasons, firstly keep the file size down and secondly I'm just plain lazy and I dont want to draw anuthing more than is needed.
A good trick I've used for backgrounds is to create the background detail like furniture as flat shaped colored symbols that are recycled. Just enough flat detail to tell the audience what its supposed to be. Use alpha to blend detail into the background. Take a look at http://www.flashtoonz.com/html/thief.html
The same background constantly reappears in different perspectives, stretched, squeezed etc..,very little file size penalty but you dont notice it. My biggest battle is with audio. Keeping the thing small but without sacrificing clarity. Its a juggling act for sure. I've found audio tends to take half your file size or more. Theres no real secret to keeping files small. I draw everything with a wacom pad directly in flash. That helps. Turn nearly everything into symbols and recyle elements as much as possible. Use audio sparingly. Atmosphere sounds (traffic noises) are looped. Effects sounds are very short. Music is looped. Work on the story. Use lots of different scenes. Wide shot, MCU etc, just like in the movies . Reycle scenes as much as possible as the story unfolds. Work on the story. I hope this info helps...

PS Toonbboom 2 is available for 30 day demo download and is very good. It will even automate your lipsync for you. I just wish it had the ability to scrub audio directly on the timeline like flash, not the way they have it configured at the moment...

[Bob Hartzell]

I find it interesting that in the last week people from PrayStation and FlashToonz have contributed to our forum -- people who apparently don't use KoolMoves. I am wondering how they stumbled onto the threads.

[mmreed]

Originally posted by Bob Hartzell
I find it interesting that in the last week people from PrayStation and FlashToonz have contributed to our forum -- people who apparently don't use KoolMoves. I am wondering how they stumbled onto the threads.

Bob -

I was in contact with Flashtoonz... asking what tips he had for keeping file sizes low and how he achieved such good results in his creations.

As for praystation - I don't know... looking at the post it sounds as if someone contacted them as well.

[chance]

Love the toons on flashtoonz.com. Can anyone tell me how to achieve the effect of background moving. Is it a movie on top of a movie, panning, or what. I can't seem to duplicate it. (Or can I not see the forest for the trees)?
Thanks for your help.